Official Aviation Thread...

[LateFan]

Saw Miss Montana the DC-3 fly over this afternoon, headed straight east. Might be where she's headed!

[george graves]

Have fun at Oshkosh! I love the videos of the ATC work. Amazing how they pack you guys all in.

[BlackbirdM3]

Leaving for Oshkosh on Sunday. I have my photo assignments, and I'm in the process of putting together a photo shoot with a dozen Beech Staggerwings, and at least one Spartan Executive.

Should be a good week.

Will

[LateFan]

I heard a satisfying rumble just now, walked outside, and a DC-3 passed right over my house, doing some little tail skids. Nice.

[varg]

Looks that way from the diagram. I don't work on them or design them or anything I just pulled some diagrams so I had an idea of what I was looking at.

[LateFan]

So is that oil nozzle in the diagram not spraying oil on that center bearing, and it cooked itself?

[varg]

Looks like there's more to it than previous incidents involving nose cone separation (http://www.bst-tsb.gc.ca/eng/rapport.../a02p0021.html) since you can see what appears to be a glowing bearing. With just the cone removed there's supposed to be a front accessory drive cover over the #1 bearing, for some reason that's gone in this case, it appears to be still attached to the cone bouncing around on the IGVs. With that gone N1 tach went with it so I'm sure the pilots noticed something when N1 dropped to zero and oil quantity started falling.

[george graves]

looks like it was still producing power. i bet the only indication in the cockpit was the N1 vibration gage probably went through the roof.

How sucky is it when a passenger has to tell the flight attendant, and then the flight attendant has to tell the captain, that your engine is about to fart out some blades? I assume you have to go back to look?

[flyboyx]

looks like it was still producing power. i bet the only indication in the cockpit was the N1 vibration gage probably went through the roof.

[LateFan]

MD-88 engine failure....yike

https://twitter.com/Micahlifa/status/1148708669166628869?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1148708669166628869&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fgizmodo.com%2Fajax%2Finset%2Fiframe%3Fid%3Dtwitter-1148708669166628869%26autosize%3D1

[LateFan]

http://legendsintheirowntime.com/LiT...uito_draft.pdf

Page 23, but the whole thing is worth reading.

BTW, this is fantastic - really interesting. It's built very much like plywood boat hulls or kayaks - stiff, fair, light. Solid blocks here and there for reinforcement just like a boat. These days they'd make that with West System epoxy resin for all the bonding. It's cool the way the wing is built - a hollow box beam at front and rear, with ribs between and a sandwich skin. That engine cradle essentially cantilevers off the forward wing spar, which seems like it would cause a lot of twist, but then it's balanced with the struts for the landing gear. Then the landing gear loads are transmitted to the steel engine cradle. Clever.

The one my son built was the black nighttime reconnaissance plane I think.

[LateFan]

... from a business point of view continuing to make money on sales with smaller investment during the long and very expensive development of a new plane doesn't seem like a bad idea. If they're obviously outcompeted on efficiency and other aspects by current Airbus offerings and are in the region of diminishing returns with the 737 airframe, it would certainly make sense to be developing its replacement as older models are continuously reaching end-of-life. It's a common problem with massive companies, they become unwilling to take any risk at all and slow the advance of the market overall.

And I wonder if these decisions were affected by absorbing the massive costs of the 787 development, which included disasters of various suppliers major assemblies not lining up, huge delays (years), and then the battery fire fiasco.

I wonder if Boeing has spent more on modifying and tweaking the 737 airframe than they would have just doing a new design. They've redone nearly everything on it - the length, the balance, all new wings, the dorsal fin extension, generations of engine mount redesigns....

Remember years ago when several 737s rolled and crashed before they discovered it was a yaw control valve jamming in the rudder? Imagine that liability and massive cost in there as well (although that had nothing to do with the overall airplane design).

[hoveringuy]

I support the military derivative of the 737, the P-8.

The beauty of the 737 isn't that it's the latest and greatest design that squeezes the most revenue out of the crew and fuel, but that it's so mature that it's become incredibly reliable and has a very robust supply and overhaul back-end.

I'm certain that the Comac C919 is a better, more modern design than the 737, but what it also offers in Spades is RISK.

[flyboyx]

It is definitely growing. I’m sure that partially spurned the decision to put more lipstick on the pig.

There are simply a lot of companies out there like southwest, Alaska, and United that will suck boeing’s Dick no matter the cost. In many ways, these companies keep the 73 line chugging along and probably will until the company screws up the courage to build a mini 787. Whenever they do, it will indeed replace the current offering.

[varg]

I definitely understand what you're saying, and I am ignorant to whether Boeing is currently developing a replacement to the 737 and competitor/replacement for the more modern Airbus. The two projects wouldn't have to be mutually exclusive, and from a business point of view continuing to make money on sales with smaller investment during the long and very expensive development of a new plane doesn't seem like a bad idea. If they're obviously outcompeted on efficiency and other aspects by current Airbus offerings and are in the region of diminishing returns with the 737 airframe, it would certainly make sense to be developing its replacement as older models are continuously reaching end-of-life. It's a common problem with massive companies, they become unwilling to take any risk at all and slow the advance of the market overall. Aviation has been an industry plagued with constant mergers and acquisitions, ever condensing towards fewer and fewer companies and less and less competition.

Is the overall Boeing 737 fleet currently growing, at replacement levels or shrinking?