$5 Gas in 2012?

[joshh]

Blaming the feds for the diesel engine's failure to compete in the US is a cop out. There are far more significant market factors such as the rest of the world's demand for diesel fuel and the expense of emissions controls. Diesel cars will always remain a nitch market in the US. The cost of hybrid components will keep dropping and they'll become more main stream. Thats been the trend for 10 years now.
I'm really amazed how many gear heads look for any excuse to hate hybrids because they really don't understand how the technology works. Oh well.

41 city, 58 highway for the bluemotion on the euro cycle. You can subtract 15% to get the EPA numbers. Neither the bluemotion passat or polo are available over here.

Let me know when your hybrids aren't run off of coal/oil electricity.

[mrsleeve]

Well I understand how the tech works. it heavy, inefficient and a DEAD END.

When you can buy a TDI jetta for the same price and get 2-300k miles outta it with just minor servicing even with the slight perminum in fuel costs you will still be a winner in the long run with extra cash in your pockets that owning a stupid complicated hybrid, that is way worse for the environment than any conventional car from a total resource cost to make it.

Next again if it was not for the GM in the 80's giving it a bad name with shitty cars. But look at what has happened once Diesel began to gain in popularity in the US the Feds got their regulation hats on and made it unpalatable for those that dont quite get it again with taxation and costly refinement, and emissions mandates that both kill the over all total efficiency of the engines and take away all monetary incentives to own one. Especially since the 2010 regs hit.

[tjts1]

We import crude and make shit outta it. Very little gas if any to my recollection.

Yes we sell diesel to other nations

The Feds have forced stupid requirements on fuel guide lines for production. The extra refinement that is unfounded and the fuel that comes from it is very hard on diesel fuel systems all have pushed the cost of Diesel way the fuck up as well.

But seriously go look as find a station that sells Red #2 for off road use. Cost is similar if not a touch less than Gas. Care to guess why????

Blaming the feds for the diesel engine's failure to compete in the US is a cop out. There are far more significant market factors such as the rest of the world's demand for diesel fuel and the expense of emissions controls. Diesel cars will always remain a nitch market in the US. The cost of hybrid components will keep dropping and they'll become more main stream. Thats been the trend for 10 years now.
I'm really amazed how many gear heads look for any excuse to hate hybrids because they really don't understand how the technology works. Oh well.

What about a passat?

41 city, 58 highway for the bluemotion on the euro cycle. You can subtract 15% to get the EPA numbers. Neither the bluemotion passat or polo are available over here.

[M42Power]

http://www.nextgreencar.com/view-car/24580/VW-Passat-Estate-Diesel-Manual-5-speed

[M42Power]

What about a passat?

[mrsleeve]

OH no a whopping 6 cents. Is that why diesel always costs 10% more than gasoline?
Why do you think the the US is a net importer of crude oil and refined gasoline while the US is a net exporter of refined diesel fuel? Is it because of the big bad federal government? Hmmmm....

We import crude and make shit outta it. Very little gas if any to my recollection.

Yes we sell diesel to other nations

The Feds have forced stupid requirements on fuel guide lines for production. The extra refinement that is unfounded and the fuel that comes from it is very hard on diesel fuel systems all have pushed the cost of Diesel way the fuck up as well.

But seriously go look as find a station that sells Red #2 for off road use. Cost is similar if not a touch less than Gas. Care to guess why????

[tjts1]

Meet the vw polo bluemotion 1.6 Tdi

Polo is not a midsize car. Thanks for playing.

[M42Power]

Whatever you say bro. When your midsize diesel does 51 mpg city call me.

Meet the vw polo bluemotion 1.6 Tdi

[tjts1]

OH no a whopping 6 cents. Is that why diesel always costs 10% more than gasoline?
Why do you think the the US is a net importer of crude oil and refined gasoline while the US is a net exporter of refined diesel fuel? Is it because of the big bad federal government? Hmmmm....

[mrsleeve]

Whatever you say bro. Reality has another opinion.

fed use taxes gas per gallon 18.4 cents Diesel 24.9 cents.

Not to even mention the fact that US govt uses more diesel than anyone, and with the stupid mandates that cause the extra refining to make it more. Plus we still have not gone back to full summer fuel production in the north so that holds the price of diesel up a ways too.

[tjts1]

Whatever you say bro. When your midsize diesel does 51 mpg city call me.

[mrsleeve]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

If you get the feds to drop the taxes on Diesel down to the same as it is on gas Diesel will be cheaper than reg. again.



Hybrids are a dead end technology period developing them much further is going to be a fools folly and coat all of us the tax payers a shit load more money, its fucking assinie (SP)

[tjts1]

As long as diesel fuel costs more per gallon than gasoline people will never go big on diesels in this country. The cost of cleaning up the emissions from a diesel is constantly increasing with stricter rules while the cost of hybrids keeps dropping like all electronics have throughout the last 30 years. The cheapest TDI you can buy today in the US is within a couple of hundred bucks of the cheapest Prius. The hybrid will always have an FE advantage over the diesel in stop and go driving where we spend most of our time so its kind of a no brainer. If you spend all your time on the highway by all means go for the diesel otherwise it doesn't really make sense.
Honda's IMA system is idiotic because the car will not move without the gasoline engine being turned on. Other systems where the electric motor and gasoline engine can be run separately are more mature but they're still in their infancy with the exception of a few toyotas. The system in the chevy volt is by far the dumbest shit i've ever seen. 4000lb for a 4 seater compact that costs almost twice as much as a prius? Give a break.

[mrsleeve]

Diesel went down 4 cents last night. Currently at 4.39 a gal now.

paid 3.87 for Diesel 2 days ago, and 3.34 for gas 4-5 days ago. (yes we are a oil producing state and have 4 refineries here as well so our pricing stays fairly decent)


M42: We are not allowed to have those really efficient diesels here in this country, Our Govt has banned them via Stupid emissions regulations. IIRC the EU has or is going to adopt the same or even more restrictive guidelines so look for all your little ultra efficient shit boxes, too need Exhaust Fluid and mileage to tank in the near future

[QUKBMER]

Thats it, im buying my bosses smart car.