De Niro says it best

[LBJefferies]

hence why we are headed for a cliff to fall from.

Why is it just assumed that this is the case? Because I personally don't believe this at all but whatever.

[R3Z3N]

^Because it happens to all governments.

Because our morals and growth have disappeared.

Because we allow crooks in office instead of prosecuting.

Because we promote drunkenness, promiscuous behavior, self indulgence, and hate.

This is the way of progressives and liberals. Of anyone without guidance. However, nothing is new under the sun. It's all been said and done before.

[Schnitzer318is]

Why is it just assumed that this is the case? Because I personally don't believe this at all but whatever.

Because the right has to get you scared enough to think the country is falling apart to vote for the Donald. Truth is... it's not. I don't agree with Obama's policies, but fact is unemployment is steady in the mid single digits, GDP is growing (albeit very minimally), and Hillary will continue the same. She will do some good stuff too (though I don't know how she'll pay for it).

Unfortunately, other things that could use changing... won't. National debt, lack of skilled labor jobs, prosecution for white collar crime (including politicians), etc.

[R3Z3N]

GDP is growing (albeit very minimally)
Unfortunately, other things that could use changing... won't. National debt, lack of skilled labor jobs, prosecution for white collar crime (including politicians), etc.

GDP is growing slower than ever. See attachment. It's not fear. It's truth.

http://www.multpl.com/us-gdp-growth-rate

[R3Z3N]

Another note, the word Liberal and Progressive should change. They are neither, and progress for a progressive is not good for anyone.

[Schnitzer318is]

GDP is growing slower than ever. See attachment. It's not fear. It's truth.

Growing slower than ever... is still growing is it not? As a company owner... I'd prefer to see 2% growth. Just because it's slower than ever is not a reason for fear. Just like Moore's Law... you can only grow (or shrink in the case of Moore's Law) so fast for so long before hitting a plateau. The sky is not falling.

Because our morals and growth have disappeared.

Because we allow crooks in office instead of prosecuting.

Because we promote drunkenness, promiscuous behavior, self indulgence, and hate.

It's all been said and done before.

Though I do agree with the above. Americans are so self-important and arrogant now. No one can look outside of themselves anymore to show compassion, empathy, or even just passing thoughtfulness in day to day activities. As I said we do need to prosecute crime in companies and in government. Both Hillary and Trump should be in jail.

[roznic]

[roguetoaster]

No one can look outside of themselves anymore to show compassion, empathy, or even just passing thoughtfulness in day to day activities. As I said we do need to prosecute crime in companies and in government. Both Hillary and Trump should be in jail.

Seriously? Clearly we'd need someone in authority to level solid charges, due process and an actual trial before either of them could land in jail. Why do people continue to act as if they are the law enforcement, and the judicial system? We just don't know enough to make that call, and the media cannot give us the information to make a fair or reasonable decision in this area.

Anyway, if we only look at all of the bad shit going on we completely ignore the general basic decency of the vast majority of the inhabitants (not just the citizens!) of this nation on an individual level. As a group, we suck to a large degree, but we don't need to cancel recess for everyone because a few jackasses acted up.

So, even as we all disagree vehemently on a large number of topics and vision for the future I wish we could all take a few moments to consider that we are all working towards the betterment of the place we call home. This means that we should at least try to listen to others without dismissing their ideas out of hand even if they seem crazy at first, after all, the truth is almost always somewhere in the middle of both ends of the spectrum of what the media spits out.

[Schnitzer318is]

So, even as we all disagree vehemently on a large number of topics and vision for the future I wish we could all take a few moments to consider that we are all working towards the betterment of the place we call home. This means that we should at least try to listen to others without dismissing their ideas out of hand even if they seem crazy at first, after all, the truth is almost always somewhere in the middle of both ends of the spectrum of what the media spits out.

I agree. I'm one of the few on here who doesn't resort to name calling and am willing to listen to anyone who has an opinion... whether I agree with it or not... and then hold a discussion pertaining to that opinion. We may not agree at the end, but at least there is communication.

I don't agree that we are all here trying to better our country for everyone. I think a large number of the population (and those running it) are only concerned with bettering their own circumstances. That applies to people of all classes, races, and religions.

As for disagreeing the two of these candidates should be in jail... that's fine, you are obviously entitled to that opinion. Remember, Martha Stewart was jailed for insider trading that every member of Congress is able to partake in with impunity. Banking CEO's went unpunished for blatant fraud in 2008. I am of the belief that there probably is enough evidence for Hillary to go to jail, if only for a short amount of time. I remember Whitewater as well. And Trump... hell his courtroom career is littered with offenses that warrant jail time. Again, you are welcome to disagree.

There is entirely too much money in politics (coming from all angles/sources) and the temptation too great for most of these career politicians to resist.

[roguetoaster]

Agree with much of what you said, and have said it before that there is a distinct lack of fairness/even application in our judicial process, but we still don't have enough actual, factual information to make more than an assumption that anyone should land in prison (those are a whole other issue too).

I do think that even the most misguided politician is there to do more than line their own pockets or increase their standing. Even if it's just a tiny kernel of patriotism buried deep, deep down.

Glad to hear that there is at least one reasonable person left to confirm my suspicions.

[BraveUlysses]

^Because it happens to all governments.

Because our morals and growth have disappeared.

Because we allow crooks in office instead of prosecuting.

Because we promote drunkenness, promiscuous behavior, self indulgence, and hate.

This is the way of progressives and liberals. Of anyone without guidance. However, nothing is new under the sun. It's all been said and done before.

Nope, its also the way of the no-longer-moral-majority, who are apparently ok with these things in their choice to endorse and vote for trump:

[gwb72tii]

holmes, uslysses you're seeing pink elephants

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-19/ignore-pink-elephant-room-dilberts-adams-explains-anti-trumpers-shared-illusion

[R3Z3N]

Nope, its also the way of the no-longer-moral-majority, who are apparently ok with these things in their choice to endorse and vote for trump:

If a Christian accepts these things as being acceptable, they are not Christian. However, Christian or not should vote a candidate.

[gwb72tii]

here holmes, this will make your day
listen to the vid from the most accurate poll historically

http://www.investors.com/politics/trump-leads-clinton-by-one-point-going-into-debate-in-ibdtipp-tracking-poll/

[BraveUlysses]

holmes, uslysses you're seeing pink elephants

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-1...hared-illusion

But Trump is the bigger agent for change, if that’s what you think the country needs. I want voters to see that choice for what it is.

Change for what exactly? This man has no principles.

Who would think that "Change" is the current mantra of people who were overwhelmingly opposed to "change" 8 years ago?

here holmes, this will make your day
listen to the vid from the most accurate poll historically

http://www.investors.com/politics/tr...tracking-poll/

"historically"

The IBD/TIPP tracking poll has been cited as the most accurate in predicting actual election results in the past three presidential elections.