No more MT BMWs in 2019 - and why I'll never buy anything past an EXX series

[rturbo 930]

It has a name now, called the Tayman

They really put some effort into the name there, huh?

[Aleman]

Here's the competition. It's called the Mission E. Saw it at Rennsport Reunion VI at Laguna Seca 1 week ago today.

Vital specs:
Range: 300 miles
Top Speed: 155 mph
0-62 mph: < 3.5 seconds

Talking with factory reps - to be priced to compete with Tesla

It looked killer....

It looks like a tampon with wheels.

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[TobyB]

Yes, BMW cares about its enthusiasts, but what should they do? Build a bunch of 6 speed manual 340's which nobody will buy new, let them sit for years and sell at a discounted rate to us?

Yes. Of course. That's berzactly what I want them
to do.

Silver, please!

Realistically, I find the e46 a bit too big, so a one series in 15 years
will probably be a pretty good fit.

methinks.

t

[lukeADE335i]

They've made that clear in the worldwide press releases, but given the massive list of 'individual' options - they'll even paint the car to match your handbag if you like! Then why not add the MT to the individual program on some models. Would keep the enthusiasts happy.

That said - maybe the next generation EVs are the answer for enthusiasts as pointed out?!

[roguetoaster]

Well, you can't even order on generally if they haven't had the engine/transmission combo tested and rated. So I suspect that one will not be able to order M/T.

[E30 Wagen]

I don't know, I have a hard time believing that if a dealership ordered a 6 speed M-sport 230i, M240i, or 340i, red with black interior, and put it in the showroom that it wouldn't get any interest. Park it next to an expensive 7 series to really set it off as a sexy, fun sports car. There's bound to be at least one compulsive spender out there looking for something flashy and fun to drive, so I don't understand why BMW or its dealerships don't even try and market to those people. Somebody with $50k burning a whole in their pocket probably doesn't want to sit down with a salesman for an hour to fill out an order form and wait 6 months. They want to see and drive the car, but if they show up to a dealer and 90% of the inventory are black, white, or silver automatic 3ers and X3s then they'll just go a Ford dealership that has like seven Mustangs to choose from.

[Staszek]

Here's the competition. It's called the Mission E. Saw it at Rennsport Reunion VI at Laguna Seca 1 week ago today.

Vital specs:
Range: 300 miles
Top Speed: 155 mph
0-62 mph: < 3.5 seconds

Talking with factory reps - to be priced to compete with Tesla

It looked killer....

It has a name now, called the Tayman, I was just invited to put a preorder deposit down of $2500. I’m considering it, but honestly would like to drive it first. It’s said to be there Tesla S killer.

[tinoe30]

Here's the competition. It's called the Mission E. Saw it at Rennsport Reunion VI at Laguna Seca 1 week ago today.

Vital specs:
Range: 300 miles
Top Speed: 155 mph
0-62 mph: < 3.5 seconds

Talking with factory reps - to be priced to compete with Tesla

It looked killer....

[lukeADE335i]

Who says they have to build them to sit? BMW's whole manufacturing process allows for the customization of everything. They can build pretty much anything you want (for a price). Endless color, engine, drivetrain and interior choices. But 3 pedals? Oh man, that would cost too much.. ;)

The irony of course is that for Europe there are 3 pedal G20s (sure - only in the diesels) - so the engineering has already been done to fit 3 pedals to whatever G20 really. If there are proposed manual 1 & 2 series, then logically there could just as easily be manual 3 series. Perhaps as an 'individual' option if uptake is too low?

Still with how big the G20 has become it's likely that the next generation 2 series coupe and GT will be the ones enthusiasts want anyway.

[nando]

BMW owns Rolls Royce :p

[varg]

The newest touted feature of the G20? The roundels now stay horizontal instead of rotating with the wheels.

For real? Move over Rolls Royce, BMW is trying to take over your market with the new 3 series :giggle:

[nando]

Do you buy NEW BMW's? That's the issue, someone has to buy them, and if we don't (which we... don't) nobody will, especially the new car buyer.

Had a cup of coffee with my friend at BMW yesterday, number one vehicle sold at his dealership? X3, overall take of manual transmission vehicles as a new car buyer? less than 1%

Yes, BMW cares about its enthusiasts, but what should they do? Build a bunch of 6 speed manual 340's which nobody will buy new, let them sit for years and sell at a discounted rate to us?

I see your point, but from a marketing/sales perspective the numbers just don't add up.

Who says they have to build them to sit? BMW's whole manufacturing process allows for the customization of everything. They can build pretty much anything you want (for a price). Endless color, engine, drivetrain and interior choices. But 3 pedals? Oh man, that would cost too much.. ;)

The newest touted feature of the G20? The roundels now stay horizontal instead of rotating with the wheels. Are you kidding me? This is what people are paying $60k for? We already have to endure fake engine sounds and M branded everything.

And you're sure BMW hasn't completely lost it?

[majdomo]

Do you buy NEW BMW's? That's the issue, someone has to buy them, and if we don't (which we... don't) nobody will, especially the new car buyer.

This. The cost of developing, marketing, building and delivering new cars every year is enormous, and if they don’t recover that investment the company goes under...along with the support for us broke-ass (speaking for myself!) enthusiasts.

Maybe what I get most torqued about is how BMW seems to have “walked away from what made it successful,” but what that really means is “walked away from what I found awesome about the brand and it doesn’t seem to care about that any more.” It’s a selfish, navel-gazing thing to say, really, but it’s how I feel about just about every new car in the lineup. It’s not for me. But it’s for someone. On balance, I’m really glad for that.



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[Todd Black 88]

Nobody buys new Bmw's.

The overwhelming majority are leased by folks looking for an image presentation, whether it’s work related or personal reasons. Leased cars are overwhelmingly automatic as they are easier to resale.

Here in Vancouver, where there is a new BMW on every corner, the leased percentage is in the mid 90% range according to my buddy who is a sales manager at a local BMW dealership.

There is also the federal (Canada anyways, I assume the US has the same or similar) fleet fuel economy and emissions issue. Automatics are better, especially in the high performance high fuel consumption M cars, at fuel economy and emissions control. Technology at work.


Also, enthusiasts are smart and buy used. Who the hell wants to take the hit on a new bmw after 2 years? I bought my 2012 328xit 6 speed as a 6 month old repo. I payed 28k less than the sticker price was new. It had 12k kilometres on it. (7500 miles or so.)

[James Crivellone]

So it doesn't follow that BMW shouldn't care about the 2nd hand market, because those are the people who already love BMWs and are more likely to choose that brand first if they are in the market for a new car.

Do you buy NEW BMW's? That's the issue, someone has to buy them, and if we don't (which we... don't) nobody will, especially the new car buyer.

Had a cup of coffee with my friend at BMW yesterday, number one vehicle sold at his dealership? X3, overall take of manual transmission vehicles as a new car buyer? less than 1%

Yes, BMW cares about its enthusiasts, but what should they do? Build a bunch of 6 speed manual 340's which nobody will buy new, let them sit for years and sell at a discounted rate to us?

I see your point, but from a marketing/sales perspective the numbers just don't add up.