Not that it matters but, gays?

[Kershaw]

Sure

The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins. do yourself a favor and read it. if nothing else, your faith will be strengthened because you have heard the opposing argument and still believe. your faith is strong enough to handle a little critique, right?

i hang out with gay guys all the time. i have 4 gay friends i see on a weekly basis. hanging out with them has not increased the desire to stick a penis in my mouth. i just dont get why people think gay guys can corrupt america and turn everyone gay. that is not how it works. ask yourself this, do you like tittys? could you decide one day you dont like titties? i know i couldnt. and if you can, wow, you've got some serious control over your own brain.

why would anyone choose to be part of an ostracized group? a group where membership means almost daily harassment, possible physical abuse, and even death by violence? were christians running around nazi germany yelling, "IM A JEW! PICK ME PICK ME!" no. that's dumb.

and travish, what you call "common sense" is really just ignorance. opposites attract? so... im guessing you are really attracted to christian hating, stalin loving communists, right? dude. dont be ridiculous.

next time, before you go spouting off some silliness, please base your argument on on actual study. your own ingrained "common sense" will not do. even the people that i do not agree with most of the time on the forums (joshh, gwb, vdubin, and to a lesser extent mrsleeve) usually use a study to back up their argument. i will most likely do my best to argue as to why that research is wrong by providing other studies that i consider more proven. BUT, they arent shooting out of their ass like you.

You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to what you can argue for.

[frankenbeemer]

I approve of this thread.

[camshaftgsxr]

Back on topic:

What I don't understand is how people become gay all of a sudden. My best friend's dad from highschool was married for 8 years then got divorced and over the years has been becoming "gayer and gayer" for lack of a better term. He used to be a pretty macho guy, in terms of his mannerisms. No he has a boyfriend and talks a little different and just acts kind of like a female.

Another guy I work with has two kids and an ex-wife but is now gay and does drag on the weekends. wtf?

IMHO guys don't "become gay all of a sudden." There are lots of social pressures to be in denial or pretend. A majority of gay guys realized they were different by middle childhood but don't even understand what it was and stayed under cover. It used to be, say fifteen years ago, that guys would come out after they were out of the family home. These days many more are coming out much younger, and often get disowned. About one third of homeless youth are GLBT who were either thrown out or left home after their lives there were made a living hell. Gay isn't what the person does, it's what turns him or her on. That tends to be fairly stable throughout the life span, more for males than females.

denial is a bitch, lots of gay men have feelings and attractions to other men but are so far into being the way society deems as "normal" by showing heterosexual lifestyles and advertising with only heterosexual couples (how many commercials feature gay couples doing asinine things?) that they dont even have thoughts that they can be with a man in "that way" and many realize that these feelings are ok half way through a marriage to a woman they are trying to be attracted to.

oh... and hanging out with queens with make you a flamboyant waffleswaffleswaffleswaffleswaffleswaffles in no time. just like hanging out with football players makes you extra macho for a short time.


let the "ask a queer" segment begin

[DaveNorCal]

IMHO guys don't "become gay all of a sudden." There are lots of social pressures to be in denial or pretend. A majority of gay guys realized they were different by middle childhood but don't even understand what it was and stayed under cover. It used to be, say fifteen years ago, that guys would come out after they were out of the family home. These days many more are coming out much younger, and often get disowned. About one third of homeless youth are GLBT who were either thrown out or left home after their lives there were made a living hell. Gay isn't what the person does, it's what turns him or her on. That tends to be fairly stable throughout the life span, more for males than females.

[be34st]

Eh its not an unknown. its pretty obvious if you just open your eyes and look around rather than just believing everything you see in the media. Im blessed at 21 with a wonderful life, wealth, a gorgeous wife, can go on and on. I've never been in need for anything and all I've done is have faith that my God will take care of me and chose to believe what I feel is right and not what the fake Christians most people think of believe because unlike most people in this world I can think for myself.

Not trying to prove or diprove anything really here, but explain this to me by your logic.

I grew up in a religious household with a religious single mom that suffered from depression and alcoholism. I was taught to pray and have faith in god growing up and I always did. Yet, I've been homeless more times that I can probably remember, been hungry slept in cars, seen my mom abused and all kinds of other shit. I dont really believe in any diety so much anymore and decided to take control of my own life. Now I'm successful at 23 with a nice place, beautiful woman, a couple cool cars and i don't really need for anything.

Was it god? Or was it me?

Back on topic:

What I don't understand is how people become gay all of a sudden. My best friend's dad from highschool was married for 8 years then got divorced and over the years has been becoming "gayer and gayer" for lack of a better term. He used to be a pretty macho guy, in terms of his mannerisms. No he has a boyfriend and talks a little different and just acts kind of like a female.

Another guy I work with has two kids and an ex-wife but is now gay and does drag on the weekends. wtf?

[camshaftgsxr]

ITT a bunch of straight dudes say:

"i dont mind gay people, as long as they act straight in public."

personally.. i dont care if people are straight as long as they dont push it on me, pointing out pretty girls, having pictures of half naked women everywhere, posting thread after thread of half naked chicks on a car forum, mechanics with matco calenders on their tool boxes, kissing in public?? eww gross how dare you kiss a girl in front of me, or parade your wedding ring around. not to mention. its those mouth breathing, girl fucking heterosexuals that really piss me off, why cant they just act gay while they're in public? itd be so much easier to get along with them.

[travish325]

Are you open to book recommendations?

Sure

[streetwaves]

I encourage you to read a book called Evidence that demands a verdict by Josh Mcdowell. You may be like most people these days who don't read anymore and just believe whats on tv but if you aren't I recommend reading it then we can continue this argument

Are you open to book recommendations?

[travish325]

I encourage you to read a book called Evidence that demands a verdict by Josh Mcdowell. You may be like most people these days who don't read anymore and just believe whats on tv but if you aren't I recommend reading it then we can continue this argument


He was like you guys. Started out trying to disprove God as an atheist but became a Christian in the end

[travish325]

I am an alien. See, we can all make baseless statements. Its quite easy.

Ok then.

[streetwaves]

That isn't evidence of anything. It is an unknown. I am successful, have plenty of material wealth, in great shape and have a girlfriend. Its not god, its the tooth fairy. I have faith in the tooth fairy to see me through this life and you cant prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist.

The tooth fairy has given me a total of $1.75 in life. That's $1.75 more than god has given me.

[Ryan Stewart]

You are evidence.

I am an alien. See, we can all make baseless statements. Its quite easy.

[travish325]

That isn't evidence of anything.

You are evidence.

[Ryan Stewart]

Eh its not an unknown. its pretty obvious if you just open your eyes and look around rather than just believing everything you see in the media. Im blessed at 21 with a wonderful life, wealth, a gorgeous wife, can go on and on. I've never been in need for anything and all I've done is have faith that my God will take care of me and chose to believe what I feel is right and not what the fake Christians most people think of believe because unlike most people in this world I can think for myself.

That isn't evidence of anything. It is an unknown. I am successful, have plenty of material wealth, in great shape and have a girlfriend. Its not god, its the tooth fairy. I have faith in the tooth fairy to see me through this life and you cant prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist.

[streetwaves]

So you can insult me because you say I'm a nuts Christian and get away with it but people can't say anything about gays without getting in trouble for not be politicaly correct? That makes so much sense.

I don't know who you think I am, but you're not "in trouble." You stated an opinion I disagree with. I am in as much "trouble" as you are, and I could very well get some flak from religious people here who don't like my comment. That's how this works.

You say its more natural to have sex with another dude than believe in God?
I feel sorry for you but to each there own.

The word 'natural' does not necessarily have any moral value. Also, having sex with a dude is a decision based on the same natural processes in a brain that, in another person, cause them to have heterosexual sex. That there is nothing morally wrong with either of these decisions is the point.