No one needs 15 rounds

[The Dark Side of Will]

So on one hand you say that more people with more guns (CCW or otherwise) will reduce gun crime because there are more "good guys" with weapons to stop the "bad guys" with weapons, but on the other hand you say that those same good guys have been trained NOT to get involved, that they shouldn't get involved, and that it's not their place to do anything unless they feel super-duper safe and all warm 'n' fuzzy about their chances.

How do you reconcile those things in your head?

You don't carry to feel warm and fuzzy, but you don't carry to be a vigilante either.

What he's saying is that "active response"... ie, clearing the mall in which there's an active shooter is not something that the average armed citizen should try. It's risky enough when teams trained for clearing try it.

BUT, if you're in a situation in which you need that last option, carrying makes the difference between leaving on your feet or on a stretcher or in a body bag.

You need to remember that real life isn't a movie or a video game. You don't know how any given encounter will turn out.

[CorvallisBMW]

LOL I would not even use my gun in that situation unless I was cornered and had no way to escape. You dont attack a crazy guy with a fucking shotgun unless you have a massive advantage like a rifle you can engage the guy effectively from a safer range for you. Or you have some kind of huge advantage of surprise. Sorry I am not going to run toward gun fire where there is not supposed to be any, its not cowardice, one of the primary things stressed to you in a CCW course is that you are not a LEO, and your not a vigilante crime fighter because your constable gives you a permit to carry a weapon. That weapon is used to protect your self and in some cases those in your proximity if you wish to put your neck out there. Its a big legal issue in a lot of cases if you go looking for trouble, and you also put your self out there as a target for the LEO that are responding to a active shooter and man with a gun 911 call..............

If trapped and all you have is pepper spray sure then you do what you have to take the chances you need to take to try and live though it. I am not going to go looking for trouble firearm or no firearm, if it finds me though no fault of my own then I will defend myself or family like a pissed off Mama Griz with cubs and your standing between the 2. I dont have a hero complex nor have any desire to live out some kind of fantasy.

Sorry to burst your bubble that CCW holder 2a guys are all looking for a fight and carry for an ego boost big man complex.

So on one hand you say that more people with more guns (CCW or otherwise) will reduce gun crime because there are more "good guys" with weapons to stop the "bad guys" with weapons, but on the other hand you say that those same good guys have been trained NOT to get involved, that they shouldn't get involved, and that it's not their place to do anything unless they feel super-duper safe and all warm 'n' fuzzy about their chances.

How do you reconcile those things in your head?

[The Dark Side of Will]

yesterday there was a shooter at Seattle Pacific University who was taken down and stopped while trying to reload his shotgun. only one person died.

How many people would have died if he hadn't needed to reload? 1? 2? 5? There's no way to know exactly, but it would have been more.

As mentioned above... it was a shotgun.
Shotguns have magazines, but those magazines are not detachable. Reloading is a time-consuming one-at-a-time process that will seriously slow you down, especially if you haven't practiced extensively.

[marshallnoise]

Yeah, we know you're too much of a coward to get involved w/o your gun

Easy there arm chair QB.

I like how men are only men when they take on armed men unarmed. Brilliant.

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[mrsleeve]

LOL I would not even use my gun in that situation unless I was cornered and had no way to escape. You dont attack a crazy guy with a fucking shotgun unless you have a massive advantage like a rifle you can engage the guy effectively from a safer range for you. Or you have some kind of huge advantage of surprise. Sorry I am not going to run toward gun fire where there is not supposed to be any, its not cowardice, one of the primary things stressed to you in a CCW course is that you are not a LEO, and your not a vigilante crime fighter because your constable gives you a permit to carry a weapon. That weapon is used to protect your self and in some cases those in your proximity if you wish to put your neck out there. Its a big legal issue in a lot of cases if you go looking for trouble, and you also put your self out there as a target for the LEO that are responding to a active shooter and man with a gun 911 call..............

If trapped and all you have is pepper spray sure then you do what you have to take the chances you need to take to try and live though it. I am not going to go looking for trouble firearm or no firearm, if it finds me though no fault of my own then I will defend myself or family like a pissed off Mama Griz with cubs and your standing between the 2. I dont have a hero complex nor have any desire to live out some kind of fantasy.

Sorry to burst your bubble that CCW holder 2a guys are all looking for a fight and carry for an ego boost big man complex.

[BraveUlysses]

Yeah, we know you're too much of a coward to get involved w/o your gun

[mrsleeve]

yesterday there was a shooter at Seattle Pacific University who was taken down and stopped while trying to reload his shotgun. only one person died.

The hall monitor that incapacitated the shooter so others could help hold him down was either VERY brave and had no regard for his own life, or VERY VERY STUPID with no regard or his own life. I would put my money on the latter, you dont confront a guy with a fucking shotgun with a little thing of PEPPER SPRAY............ ( I have not seen the canister used but I doubt its a bear spray sized one) Balls made of tungsten, or just stupid either way not something I would have done more than likely.

[marshallnoise]

How many people would have died if he hadn't needed to reload? 1? 2? 5? There's no way to know exactly, but it would have been more.

We don't even know what gun he used. But we do know that a reasonably skilled person isn't hindered by magazine swaps. So perhaps if you banned people from being trained well, that might have the effect people are looking for.

Ediy: Saw it was a shotgun. Explains everything.

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[ParsedOut]

yesterday there was a shooter at Seattle Pacific University who was taken down and stopped while trying to reload his shotgun. only one person died.

Reloading a shotgun is a much longer process than changing a magazine in a semi-automatic pistol/rifle. Magazine bans do not affect shotguns, they usually carry less than 6-7 rounds anyway. Apples and oranges.

[CorvallisBMW]

How many people would have died if he hadn't needed to reload? 1? 2? 5? There's no way to know exactly, but it would have been more.

[2mAn]

yesterday there was a shooter at Seattle Pacific University who was taken down and stopped while trying to reload his shotgun. only one person died.

[agent]

as obvious and cringe worthy as saying it's a mute point or for all intensive purposes... or calling a BMW car a beamer. It highlights that you have no idea what you are talking about

He's not saying it, he's using it as an example.

[ParsedOut]

intensive purposes? really? you know better than that

[BraveUlysses]

[rwh11385]

intensive purposes? really? you know better than that

Rif.org bro