Trump Thread 2.0

[roguetoaster]

Concur, they physical strain is mostly gone, but yourself in their shoes, many of these people probably have a limited idea of what will happen next or how long they will be here, and they are of course dreading being sent back, now probably in a worse state than they set out.

[mrsleeve]

We all fundamentally agree I think, that its a shitty situation. That is and has been an on going issue for the last 100 years in one way or another. The solution to which is yet to be determined. Look at Western Europe when they have tired unfettered immigration of the islamic type from north and central Africa and areas of mid and near east. Its not going well for them either.

This has been issues for all word leading civilizations though out history, the perfect solution has never been found, and I dont think we are going to figure something out that will please everyone.

[roguetoaster]

I dont think we are going to figure something out that will please everyone.

Winner, winner. Just as long as whatever is being done generally makes everyone somewhat angry it's probably pretty good.

[rhE-30]

Your guys "oh, whatever shall we do?" mentallity is astonishing. Everybody damn well knows the United States M.O is to destabilize other countries till they give up access to their resources to our precious corporations.

[CarpHunter]

I think there's a gross misunderstanding by those on the right about what exactly has the left so angry. I don't believe the left is angry purely about the detention of immigrants, but more so with their treatment. Whether that be actual living conditions, or ignoring of federal laws and constitutional requirements.

When republicans ignore the due process clause of the constitution, you dismiss it and blame Democrats or immigrants. When republicans ignore federal law on how long they can hold children, you blame immigrant children. When they break federal law on the treatment of children, you dismiss it, or down play it. Would it be ok to treat your kids that way? Betting not. Kids are actually dying, and instead of republicans doing something, their just pointing fingers, and you accept that. Republicans had full control of the government, and still maintain enough power that they could fix this without a single democratic vote. It's perfectly fine to detain and process illegal immigrants, it's another to treat them as less than human while ignoring your own laws in the process. It's your system, fix the fucking thing. Don't make excuses, and don't blame immigrants for your own inadequacies.

That's why I asked where do you draw the line, before they build the ovens, or after their shoveling out the ashes?

I know that seems like a shocking question, but it's one that needs to be answered. It's not a partisan question but a personal one. There were germans who lived next to the death camps, and until they were marched threw them at the end of the war didn't believe that it was real. That Germany was capable of that, but mostly that they had supported it.

Again, I'm not saying trump is gonna start building gas chambers next week. I am merely stating that the republican party is veering more towards the more extreme aspects of right wing ideology. And at the end of that path lies war, genocide, all the bad shit. And it's being dismissed and down played. I don't hate republican ideology, some of your countries greatest presidents were republican. But the current party in no way resembles those that made it great. Or really what true republican ideology is.

[cale]

Kids are actually dying

If your concern is for the welfare and mortality of children, you'd see more success in saving lives if you successfully protested for seat-belts on school buses.

[decay]

If your concern is for the welfare and mortality of children, you'd see more success in saving lives if you successfully protested for seat-belts on school buses.

whataboutism

[decay]

One could argue that 3 hots, a cot

nope, you get a mylar blanket and can sleep on concrete, or the ground inside a chain-link fence

access to potable water on demand

sure, if you don't mind drinking from the same toilet you piss and shit in

and some form of sanitation

nope, sorry, we're out of soap and toothpaste

these are all real examples, recently

[CarpHunter]

cale
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarpHunter View Post
Kids are actually dying
If your concern is for the welfare and mortality of children, you'd see more success in saving lives if you successfully protested for seat-belts on school buses.

Jesus dude, I literally just covered this in the previous post. You are dismissing the situation. The facts of the matter are kids are dying while being held longer than legally allowed, in conditions that don't meet legal requirements while also neglecting the legally required levels of care. This is on you guys plain and simple, address the situation honestly, and fix it. Or is it better to continue using children as pawns for partisan politics?

[E30 Wagen]

Jesus dude, I literally just covered this in the previous post. You are dismissing the situation. The facts of the matter are kids are dying while being held longer than legally allowed, in conditions that don't meet legal requirements while also neglecting the legally required levels of care. This is on you guys plain and simple, address the situation honestly, and fix it. Or is it better to continue using children as pawns for partisan politics?

As we are completely overwhelmed with people seeking asylum, with thousands and thousands of backlogged cases, maybe we should just close the border until we can sufficiently address the overcrowding and let the courts catch up. Seem reasonable?

[cale]

Jesus dude, I literally just covered this in the previous post. You are dismissing the situation. The facts of the matter are kids are dying while being held longer than legally allowed, in conditions that don't meet legal requirements while also neglecting the legally required levels of care. This is on you guys plain and simple, address the situation honestly, and fix it. Or is it better to continue using children as pawns for partisan politics?

You're the one choosing to use their deaths to fuel your Nazism bullshit arguments. 6 children of tens of thousands of people detained have died under ICE control. It is a travesty but I'll callously say, given their backgrounds from nations with poor levels of health care, completely unsurprising. I am not dismissing anything, I think it's abhorrent that we're leveraging children even if their parents are breaking the law. I'm just not however buying the nonsense that this is in any way the yellow brick road to extermination 6 million people, it's a gross exaggeration and makes you look like a fool.

[mrsleeve]

nope, you get a mylar blanket and can sleep on concrete, or the ground inside a chain-link fence

I will concede 1/2 a point to you on this, as this was news to me. still likely better conditions than they would have trudging thought the desert

sure, if you don't mind drinking from the same toilet you piss and shit in

if by drinking out of the toilet you mean prison combo unit then you would be correct...

nope, sorry, we're out of soap and toothpaste

by sanitation I didnt mean toiletries I referred to when you poop in the shitter it goes away not pile up in the corner.

these are all real examples, recently

but they also are not new examples as this has been going on for a long time and predates the orange man, so why are you now getting all uppity about it and not decrying the treat of migrants 3 years ago, 5 years ago, or further back. Oh thats right Brownmangood Orangmanbad

[decay]

Oh thats right Brownmangood Orangmanbad

stop shoving that argument in my mouth, goddamnit, you're being partisan, i'm not

if you ever grasped the whole "anarchist" concept you'd understand we generally speaking don't have loyalty to any political party, and both of the degree and outcome of this practice, observed as a trend, is headed in a direction i very much don't like

[roguetoaster]

Anarchists are attempting to change affairs as they are in order to bring a new group in to place or cause the current group to alter the state of affairs. So, it's easy to see why anarchisim of any type is seen as politically motivated depending on who is in charge and how said actions might benefit an opposing political group. Unfortunately, anarchist methodologies are often unsustainable as they fail to gather support in the oveet political sphere, and thus arw unable to forment lasting change.

Also, the detention facilities are not prisons, never were made to be, and as such lack many of the necessary facilities to house humans for extended stays. That said, these people are technically criminals even though their motives (to better their lives without directly taking from others) might be laudable, and as such we have a duty to care for them in a safe, sanitary and humane manner. We are currently missing the mark, but no one really cares as it's on the Republican message to let this "scum" suffer, and inconvenient to the Democratic cause as vocal outrage will alienate voters they are looking to court in the current campaign.

[decay]

Anarchists are attempting to change affairs as they are in order to bring a new group in to place or cause the current group to alter the state of affairs. So, it's easy to see why anarchisim of any type is seen as politically motivated depending on who is in charge and how said actions might benefit an opposing political group. Unfortunately, anarchist methodologies are often unsustainable as they fail to gather support in the oveet political sphere, and thus arw unable to forment lasting change.

on the national scale, maybe, but that's usually not the goal