Can cams be installed incorrectly?

[bimmerteck]

You need to find a new shop. End of story.

[graphikg]

To Jason - how can I test how far the Vanos is advancing? And would it matter if I have tested the motor on two different Vanos units and it is still the same problem?

[Jason89i]

use 40psi of air pressure through the banjo bolt fitting. You can buy the test adapter or make your own with an old p.s. line. 1. pressurize vanos 40psi of air. 2. manually ground the solenoid and see how far the vanos advances the cam. j

[sharksforthecup]

Sharks, can I speak to you more about this and possibly even have a conversation with you over the phone? Just to let you know, my Vanos is rebuilt, and we have also tried another used good vanos just to make sure and it has still been the same problem. What are the chances that two different Vanos units have the same problem?

yeah sure. I've got a box of 4-5 vanos units and I know at least 3 of them are no good (tried installing different ones). I had a similar problem with my original swap under load. out of gear it revved up great, but in gear around 3k rpm it was falling on its face. Unplugged the vanos solenoid and the engine ran great under load. I have a Dr vanos unit now and have no problems. I'm not saying for sure this is your problem, but the symptoms do sound awfully similar...

pm me if you want give me a call

[graphikg]

pmed

[Jason89i]

i am suprized you have gone this far without determining HOW FAR the vanos is advancing. this is something that should be done with ANY cam / vanos replacement. ask the shop how many mm the chain advances. if they dont know, you might want to consider a bmw shop. J

[328ijunkie]

^This. Should be 8mm IIRC off the top of my head. i believe the bentley will tell you, the TIS def will.

[graphikg]

NEW UPDATE!

The shop opened the valve cover, and tested the vanos travel. It is within BMW spec... so that just further complicates why the car is acting in this way. Any ideas from here?

[graphikg]

Cam sensor?

[328ijunkie]

or is the cam sensor pickup on the cam installed correctly?

[EduardoGomez]

My car may be the only s5x/m5x that has had these symptoms and who's mystery has not been solved. I have no other ideas but literally change the motor entirely.

I had the same problem. Cause is intake camshaft is too advanced(vanos unit installed one tooth too advanced). On some cams the block tool does not work right.
I decided to time the cams without block tool, no dial indicators.

I put the crankshaft at TDC mark. Put the gear on the exhaust side, put chain tensioner in. Alonged the exhaust gear to be in the center of the holes with tensioner fully installed. Then I installed the intake sprocket with chain with holes in the middle. The A and E markings should be facing up on the back of the cams. Then I bolted both sprockets and carefully watched that they don't move. Then I turned the sprockets fully clockwise then installed the vanos and kept turning the sprockets counterclock wize until vanos gear fully in. The intake cam square will look slightly retarded, and vanos gear is all the way out (bottomed out at the vanos unit).

Summary: Timing blocks are preventing proper vanos gear install, causing the gear to advance intake cam by one tooth. Solution: Remove timing blocks prior to installation of vanos unit. Once vanos unit is installed the intake camshaft should slightly be off to retarded side. Thats because at this point vanos gear is bottomed out, soon as the vanos piston get some oil it will correct the intake cam timing.

Thats what fixed my problem.

[bimmerteck]

I had the same problem. Cause is intake camshaft is too advanced(vanos unit installed one tooth too advanced). On some cams the block tool does not work right.
I decided to time the cams without block tool, no dial indicators.

I put the crankshaft at TDC mark. Put the gear on the exhaust side, put chain tensioner in. Alonged the exhaust gear to be in the center of the holes with tensioner fully installed. Then I installed the intake sprocket with chain with holes in the middle. The A and E markings should be facing up on the back of the cams. Then I bolted both sprockets and carefully watched that they don't move. Then I turned the sprockets fully clockwise then installed the vanos and kept turning the sprockets counterclock wize until vanos gear fully in. The intake cam square will look slightly retarded, and vanos gear is all the way out (bottomed out at the vanos unit).

Summary: Timing blocks are preventing proper vanos gear install, causing the gear to advance intake cam by one tooth. Solution: Remove timing blocks prior to installation of vanos unit. Once vanos unit is installed the intake camshaft should slightly be off to retarded side. Thats because at this point vanos gear is bottomed out, soon as the vanos piston get some oil it will correct the intake cam timing.

Thats what fixed my problem.

Pretty good idea Edwardo! BTW-OP I had another idea last night while working on another swap's wiring harness. You don't perhaps have the connector for the evap valve control plugged into your vanos solenoid by accident do you? ;-) Pull back the boot on the vanos solenoid please and tell us what colors the wires are. :)

[samiam3356]

That would be hard being that it's usually tied in with the MAF connector BUT i guess possible.

[bimmerteck]

That would be hard being that it's usually tied in with the MAF connector BUT i guess possible.

I know where it's supposed to be. . . but the guy I was helping yesterday had "cleaned up" his e34 harness in an attempt to shave the bay or something, several plugs were relocated from their stock locations and it was causing some "issues" b/c they were plugged into the wrong things. I don't know the OP's car but I seem to keep coming back to it. Wish it was here, as it would make diagnosis easier.

[graphikg]

I had the same problem. Cause is intake camshaft is too advanced(vanos unit installed one tooth too advanced). On some cams the block tool does not work right.
I decided to time the cams without block tool, no dial indicators.

I put the crankshaft at TDC mark. Put the gear on the exhaust side, put chain tensioner in. Alonged the exhaust gear to be in the center of the holes with tensioner fully installed. Then I installed the intake sprocket with chain with holes in the middle. The A and E markings should be facing up on the back of the cams. Then I bolted both sprockets and carefully watched that they don't move. Then I turned the sprockets fully clockwise then installed the vanos and kept turning the sprockets counterclock wize until vanos gear fully in. The intake cam square will look slightly retarded, and vanos gear is all the way out (bottomed out at the vanos unit).

Summary: Timing blocks are preventing proper vanos gear install, causing the gear to advance intake cam by one tooth. Solution: Remove timing blocks prior to installation of vanos unit. Once vanos unit is installed the intake camshaft should slightly be off to retarded side. Thats because at this point vanos gear is bottomed out, soon as the vanos piston get some oil it will correct the intake cam timing.

Thats what fixed my problem.

Hmm... This seems very probable. Only because the shop did time the car 3 times to make sure it was EXACT. And if the blocks or dial indicator inhibit some cams to be timed exactly then that would make sense. However, why are some cams like that? I dont get it. How did you end up figuring this out? And are you sure your symptoms were EXACTLY like mine???

I couldnt get past 3300 rpm and the car would just die while giving me a HORRIBLE grinding, metal "screaming" sound. It sounded like my car had a short exorcism when it died at 2800-3300 rpm. Was this what you were getting? But with the vanos disconnected, it is practically perfect minus the extra vanos push. If you have the solution it would be my most grateful e30 news.