My Stainless Brake Line Failed Tonight

[reelizmpro]

^ I've used various SS braided lines the past 20 years without a single problem nor have I seen one fail in this fashion.

[LateFan]

Go on?

Yes, this ^^.

It's just a stainless flexible braiding over a rubber hose, so what's the issue?

[Matt-B]

I would hazard a guess they were over torqued, or a rock or some blunt object struck hose, perhaps, cracked before install? but OP should have noticed that.

Info below on compliant vs approved.


The United States Department of Transportation (DOT) has established numerous standards for automotive components and subsystems. The regulation for brake hoses happens to be FMVSS106. In this document, anything and everything pertaining to automotive brake hoses has been laid out in gory detail – at least, those things important to the federal government.

If a manufacturer claims their SS lines are “DOT compliant”, it means that their SS lines have passed all FMVSS106 requirements, and they have submitted the test data to the government for official certification. This does not mean they are acceptable for use on your car, but it does mean they pass the government minimum standards.

Another term you may hear in this context is “DOT approved.” However, the DOT is not in the business of actually approving or disproving compliance – they don't typically run any tests on aftermarket components themselves. Under these circumstances, one can only surmise that these manufacturers are trying to state that their lines are actually “DOT compliant”, but it never hurts to ask before you buy.

I have had SS lines that are compliant for DOT on my m50 car for quite some time, never had an issue.


Also, im not a fan of ECS, they do what lots of people like Ireland, or catuned do, and rebrand already made items as their own parts

[nando]

^ I've used various SS braided lines the past 20 years without a single problem nor have I seen one fail in this fashion.

same. Actually, the best ones I had were the old uncoated ones from IE. I put like 100,000 miles on them, I wished I hadn't replaced them (the newer ones I got were too short). There was nothing wrong with them after all those miles.

I think the ones I run now are from Blunt, they are for an E36 which are long enough for me up front.

[TobyB]

rock or some blunt object

I was going to ask if the caliper came off-
but the rock idea makes more sense.

What we all call 'stainless steel' are really Teflon lines
(which are great on their own, if fragile)
with a stainless braided cover.
Not usually rubber.

t

[Hooffenstein HD]

This is why I use OE ATE brake lines.

[ahrensNW]

Wow. Well, let this be a lesson to all of us, yet again.

I continue to be amazed that people use stainless lines. Makes me want to get my wife and kids off the road...

Lmfao dude. Reference one other ss brake line failure and I'll reference a hundred instances where rotten rubber lines have failed. I guess I don't understand your point, unless it was sarcasm.

[Hooffenstein HD]

Lmfao dude. Reference one other ss brake line failure and I'll reference a hundred instances where rotten rubber lines have failed. I guess I don't understand your point, unless it was sarcasm.

I see your point.

I always use ATE brake lines because I know they are a quality part with good QC standards. That's not to say all SS brake lines are bad but you never know and I'd rather have the peace of mind.

Knowing my luck, if my brakes failed I wouldn't be able to pull off to the side of the road like OP, Id be dead at the bottom of a cliff.

[Cephas]

Lmfao dude. Reference one other ss brake line failure and I'll reference a hundred instances where rotten rubber lines have failed. I guess I don't understand your point, unless it was sarcasm.

Ha! I think we agree. Stainless lines are no better than 30 year old rotten rubber ones. :)

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?1483369-Aftermarket-Stainless-brakelines-no-better-than-OEM

There's maybe 7 or 8 SS failures referenced here and 2 stock lines failures referenced. I'll be generous...you only have to come up with 650 stock rubber line failure examples, but can you please link them all in one post?

On a serious note: after reading the linked thread, tell me what the purpose of SS lines on a street car is?

[parkerbink]

We had a 2004,5,6 (don't remember) Peugeot 206 convertible in Mexico that had a rear rubber brake line fail in under 2 years and 10,000 kilometers.

Manmade things fail.

[flyboyx]

my thought is that the line is somehow too short and binds up when the steering wheel is turned to full lock. that could explain why the threads at the end of the failure are deformed.

i do not agree with cephas and his theory that stainless lines are crap. they should be better than oem hence the reason people spend money on them.

since they are not generally mass produced by an experienced oem manufacturer, there is a good chance the defect rate could be higher though.

[djmossm42]

I don't have personal experience with SS brake lines but considering them for my car, so these questions are also for me.

In the first year or so of driving how much driving and what type of driving did you do? Is it possible that they were never really put under a significant amount of stress such as you probably experienced through the mountains and back roads? How long was the car down before this happened? Did you bleed the brakes and put fresh fluid in? Was it necessary?

Side note, my rear rubber lines got clogged after cooking the brakes on Tuna Canyon. For those unfamiliar it's a one way downhill (fairly steep grade) stretch of road in the Santa Monica mountains/Malibu Requires a lot of heavy braking.


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[Cephas]

my thought is that the line is somehow too short and binds up when the steering wheel is turned to full lock. that could explain why the threads at the end of the failure are deformed.

i do not agree with cephas and his theory that stainless lines are crap. they should be better than oem hence the reason people spend money on them.

since they are not generally mass produced by an experienced oem manufacturer, there is a good chance the defect rate could be higher though.

I'm not 100% against stainless lines. I just don't agree that they belong on a street car at all. Stoptech's own website, which touts one of the reasons for buying stainless lines as "It provides the race car look" , says that you should inspect and replace them more often than rubber. Ever seen a 5 year old stainless line on a car? 10? 15? Not a chance.

Not to mention fitment issues, abrasion issues, inability to check them for damage, grains of dirt getting in the braiding and eating through the teflon, etc.

My track car came with 3 year old SS lines on it. They were awful and the plastic coating was peeling off the braids.

Also, and this is just semantics, but you brought it up: have you priced OE lines for an e30 from the dealer? They are over $200 for all 6. That's the only thing that goes on my track car. So if expensive = better, then yes, just buy OE.

Another thought: just because race cars use stainless lines does not make them better. Stainless lines on a race car are custom made for the application (in high end racing series) and are replaced more often than any of us get oil changes (well, more likely more often than any of us wash our cars). And they replace them that often for a reason.

So my question remains. What is the purpose of a SS brake line setup on a street car? Not trying to start an internet fight, just genuinely interested in what the perceived benefit of them is.

[reelizmpro]

I'm not 100% against stainless lines. I just don't agree that they belong on a street car at all. Stoptech's own website, which touts one of the reasons for buying stainless lines as "It provides the race car look" , says that you should inspect and replace them more often than rubber. Ever seen a 5 year old stainless line on a car? 10? 15? Not a chance.

Not to mention fitment issues, abrasion issues, inability to check them for damage, grains of dirt getting in the braiding and eating through the teflon, etc.

My track car came with 3 year old SS lines on it. They were awful and the plastic coating was peeling off the braids.

Also, and this is just semantics, but you brought it up: have you priced OE lines for an e30 from the dealer? They are over $200 for all 6. That's the only thing that goes on my track car. So if expensive = better, then yes, just buy OE.

Another thought: just because race cars use stainless lines does not make them better. Stainless lines on a race car are custom made for the application (in high end racing series) and are replaced more often than any of us get oil changes (well, more likely more often than any of us wash our cars). And they replace them that often for a reason.

So my question remains. What is the purpose of a SS brake line setup on a street car? Not trying to start an internet fight, just genuinely interested in what the perceived benefit of them is.

For the racecar look of course! I guess you missed the few posts about people including myself having run them over 20+ years without issue. My oldest lines are 20 years old exactly with exposed Stainless mesh. I have had no issues with abrasion. I removed them from my first car when it got totaled and put them on my M3. The OEM lines were all cracked and brittle. IMO, a reinforced and protected line is better than an unreinforced and unprotected line. I could have replaced with OEM but if there's something equivalent or better than OEM for a reasonable price then why not?

OEM lines can and do rupture and like I've said before I have yet to see or hear about this happening with SS braided lines. Even if they did abrade or the hose was compromised it would leak, not rupture and lose all pressure and that's a big plus as well.

[Cephas]

For the racecar look of course! I guess you missed the few posts about people including myself having run them over 20+ years without issue. My oldest lines are 20 years old exactly with exposed Stainless mesh. I have had no issues with abrasion. I removed them from my first car when it got totaled and put them on my M3. The OEM lines were all cracked and brittle. IMO, a reinforced and protected line is better than an unreinforced and unprotected line. I could have replaced with OEM but if there's something equivalent or better than OEM for a reasonable price then why not?

Are you saying stock lines don't have reinforcement? Have you read the thread I linked to where they cut them open? The OE lines have huge reinforcement and several walls of rubber. They also must pass a 5000 psi burst test after being soaked in water for 70 hours. A SS braided line is not going to be better than that.

SS lines have an exposed mesh that grabs dirt and grime and grinds it into the teflon. From Stoptech's website:

"Under certain conditions, dirt and other abrasive contaminants can find their way between the SS braid and the Teflon inner hose. Over time these contaminants can be ground into the Teflon line to the point that a leak can develop. Naturally, a leak in the brake system is never a good thing."

In the end, what benefit do your SS lines provide over stock, rubber ones that are just as reinforced?

You can like them better for subjective reasons, or think they look better, but does that make them objectively "better"?

I don't think so. And I believe that the risks associated with them are not worth it when it comes to what is the most important system on your car.