Which engine would you choose for a swap?

[nando]

S14 engine no accessories. Not sure if thats a short or long or whatever.
American car guys call a short block the actual engine block with rotating assembly installed in it.
A long block is the block, heads and intake.
Euro people seem to have a completely different vernacular of what long and short is.

The engine weight doc I have saved shows the S14 @ 235 lbs.
Using the same document the M42 is 220 lbs which I assume is in the same state and makes perfect sense that its lighter than an S14.
That doc predates the N52

yeah, sorry, those numbers you have are definitely wrong. a dressed M42 weighs a lot more than 220lbs. I'll bet you're getting your weights from here:

https://www.bimmerforums.com/2009/08/engine-faq/

Which are all short block weights (taken from the ETK) and have already been proven to be inaccurate here. That N52 weight you quoted was fully dressed, in comparison.

S14 isn't crap, but I'd be shocked if a fully dressed one weighed only 240lbs. I'd bet money the N52 rotating assembly is lighter..

[Motheye99]

Isn't the s14 really a m10 with more stuff on top? Should weigh close to a n52 then. The reason people are bagging on it is it's hp/$ ratio is way worse than a m54 or n52. I think the s14 when fully built and money is no option, but for now I have to stick to cheaper ways of getting that power.

This thread really derailed, but OP you should be the first to do a N20 swap, that's a light motor.

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[varg]

S14 engine no accessories. Not sure if thats a short or long or whatever.

The engine weight doc I have saved shows the S14 @ 235 lbs.
Using the same document the M42 is 220 lbs which I assume is in the same state and makes perfect sense that its lighter than an S14.
That doc predates the N52

My point is that this context of its state and weight relative to another engine in similar state is critical to that weight meaning anything at all and should be mentioned when quoting the figure. Hence my comment asking if that's a short block weight because it's so much lighter than expected.

[JimmyP]

Having run a pretty well-built M44 in my e30 for years now, I’d say it’s not a bad choice. Only 2 things I would change about my build tho. 86.5 or 87mm Je pistons with rings are only around $800 and it yields nearly 2.0L. Second, they do fall flat at 6,500 and it really needs an intake cam to make it rev to 7k and make power there. Aside from that, it’s a delightful, if slightly underpowered swap, and it returns 30+ mpg with my foot buried in it all the time. It’s not that slow however, it’s slightly faster than my workmate’s 86 325i. It’s a pretty cost-effective way to have a 170hp ( or more) 4cyl. Definitely go with all the late ECU and harness, it’s worth the trouble for the improvement in throttle response alone. And get a flash on it. That woke it up also. There are cheaper ways to make more power for sure. But I can roll into any CA smog station and pass without anyone ever asking a question.

I'm in agreement, I like my M44 in my Ti and mine is not built.
I have a lightweight flywheel on it and COP, ducted cold air intake like an S14 through the rad bulkhead and I think its a blast to drive.

I'd like to build an M42 with ITBs, bigger cams, some porting and 12.5:1 with that stroker diesel crank, put it in a gutted E30 race car with a good trans..

[JimmyP]

S14 engine no accessories. Not sure if thats a short or long or whatever.
American car guys call a short block the actual engine block with rotating assembly installed in it.
A long block is the block, heads and intake.
Euro people seem to have a completely different vernacular of what long and short is.

The engine weight doc I have saved shows the S14 @ 235 lbs.
Using the same document the M42 is 220 lbs which I assume is in the same state and makes perfect sense that its lighter than an S14.
That doc predates the N52

[benz-tech]

Having run a pretty well-built M44 in my e30 for years now, I’d say it’s not a bad choice. Only 2 things I would change about my build tho. 86.5 or 87mm Je pistons with rings are only around $800 and it yields nearly 2.0L. Second, they do fall flat at 6,500 and it really needs an intake cam to make it rev to 7k and make power there. Aside from that, it’s a delightful, if slightly underpowered swap, and it returns 30+ mpg with my foot buried in it all the time. It’s not that slow however, it’s slightly faster than my workmate’s 86 325i. It’s a pretty cost-effective way to have a 170hp ( or more) 4cyl. Definitely go with all the late ECU and harness, it’s worth the trouble for the improvement in throttle response alone. And get a flash on it. That woke it up also. There are cheaper ways to make more power for sure. But I can roll into any CA smog station and pass without anyone ever asking a question.

[varg]

An S14 is just under 240 lbs

Shortblock? Because I don't believe for a second than an S14 is over 100lbs lighter than an M42.



Engine weight figures are completely meaningless without information about the state of the motor when weighed.

[JimmyP]

My bad on the N52, I thought all N motors had turbos.

I'd love a Mag /Alu block for an S14,,, but not interested in the size and the added weight of an N52.

I can lift an S14 block w/ crank, pistons, rods from the floor to my bench. They dont weigh much at all and they are a small package.

If you think the S14 is mediocre, carry on with your grocery getter engines.
I'll take 'em all.
Most of the people that bag on S14s, know really nothing about S14s.

S14B20 is a 2.0 litre version

[Motheye99]

S14b20 is real, pretty rear from my understanding. Check out the 320is.

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[Andrew325is]

I wouldn't call the S14 mediocre. If they were that bad they wouldn't be worth thousands of dollars. N52s are worth peanuts, less than M54 for some reason. Not sure why. Bargain if you can get one running in an E30.

Speaking of bargains, here's an S14 at auction in the UK someone might be able to a get a deal on. Doesn't say how many miles and no info as far as health of the engine like compression, so assume it needs a rebuild I guess. Doesn't say which variant, but maybe S14b20? I messaged the seller yesterday and haven't got a response. Might be a scam, but they've been a member since 2015, so who knows. Current bid is $2k with 2 days to go.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/complete-engine-E30-320is-for-BMW-M3-vehicle/133107436596

[Julien]

You missed the N/A part.
Try again caller

An S14 is just under 240 lbs
A quick Google on the N52B30 has it around 355 lbs
You were close though.

I want to say you're comparing the s14 short block vs the n52 long block weight wise. It's a bit of a crap shoot comparing weights of motors from online documentation, that said if the s14 is lighter than the n52 it shouldn't be by much.

yeah no turbos on the n52b30.


Also why the dick-ish attitude? Is it because you blew all your money s14'ing everything before you realized it's mediocrity?

[Staszek]

You missed the N/A part.
Try again caller

An S14 is just under 240 lbs
A quick Google on the N52B30 has it around 355 lbs
You were close though.

The N52B30 is NA and weighs 326lbs (Although there are places listing it at 308, probably without accessories.

So heavier yes, but still way more usable power.

[JimmyP]

AFAIK the N52b30 is lighter and makes a boatload more power

You missed the N/A part.
Try again caller

An S14 is just under 240 lbs
A quick Google on the N52B30 has it around 355 lbs
You were close though.

[amcp]

I've had an Eta, an I, and M42. The only thing the M42 has going for it is lighter weight over the nose. Its fun but like someone said above, the cost to performance ratio is bad. Then you add the weak points. Tensioners, profile gasket, timing chain guides, thrust bearings. Bags of meh.

Sign me up for either the s14 or the m54.

[mutty]

Drove a 318i for over a 100k miles and it always put a smile on my face. New Haven to Manhattan five days per week. I vote for the four banger. With a supercharger being developed over on bimmerforums for the m42/m44 life will be interesting for the purists.