e30 323i N54 teaser

[the imitator]

for your MSD80 DME you really just need the CAS and matching key to make it start. of course you'll also want a bunch of modules - the battery module, fuel pump module, electric fan module, etc. Error codes are pretty easy to remove.

the fuel level sensors on the E30 are nothing like newer BMWs. If you want to use the E90 cluster, you will need to swap over basically all of the rest of the E90's electronics over - including light control modules, the DSC system, etc. the only inputs to the cluster are basically power and CAN signals. Otherwise, it might be a heck of a lot simpler to just use the E30 cluster.

Hey nando, thanks for your insight on the fuel level sensor, I dont have an e30 to eyeball right now, but of course that makes sense. That helps me out, thanks!

Furthermore perhaps I can give you, and everyone else some insight on n54 start up? :)
I can confirm it takes more than just the CAS, and Key in order to get start up from an n54 engine, regardless of MSD versions, which is okay! This is just a full electrical swap, rather than seeking a way around the EWS system, which right now would take development on ones end to "crack" the dme as past version have been done. This has proven difficult.

I won't get too indepth but for several reasons but, you'll want to take everything off of a single donor vehicle; One reason being the security measure used to prevent theft, which involves 5 modules, not including the cluster, or keys; these modules need to be on the same electronic "combination" in order for wake up signals to run continuous.

We can conclude there is more needed for start up with this info on the IBS, which is the Battery module you speak of, without it, you are infact grounding out on the terminal, thus the dme wont receive a wake up signal resulting in a no start, or if you dont register your battery, the dme will adopt a newr value at idle, as explained below.

IBS:
A fault code is stored in the DME when the IBS is defective. The DME adopts a substitute value and assumes IBS emergency mode. IBS emergency mode boosts the idle speed in order to sufficiently charge the battery.
Direct diagnosis of the IBS is not possible, it can only be diagnosed
through the DME. The self diagnosis function checks the voltage, current, temperature, terminal 15 wake up signal as well as system errors in the IBS.

Note: The software in the DME and that of the IBS must match. To ensure this requirement, it may be necessary to replace the IBS in connection with a software update.

Voltage Measurement:If the IBS is shorted to ground, a DME fault code will display “Voltage Fault DME ON”.
The IBS will be unable to wake up the DME.

The only module I wont be using is the FRM, which cntrols all things auxiliary Lights,main lighting, doors, seats,display, drive, heater/ac, ETC

I will be using the E90 cluster for sure, and I'll pricing out a 335i gas tank, because who doesn't want a plastic gas tank that is also PNP with the rest of the system :)

[the imitator]

There bunch of pine green interior seats on German eBay, but for touring. I don't think they made pine green checkered for coupes or sedans.


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Ill be getting a set of 215 Stoff Piniengrün checkered door cards from a very kind gentleman overseas! It looks like I'll have a Pine green/nutria brown interior.. if that doesnt fly then I have my choice of brown, or green.. Wonderful colors.. hahaha!

[Old city bimmer]

Nice


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[the imitator]

Are you still looking for brown tinted glass?

[SweetLew]

Sub'd to this, super rad idea for a swap!

[nando]

Hey nando, thanks for your insight on the fuel level sensor, I dont have an e30 to eyeball right now, but of course that makes sense. That helps me out, thanks!

Furthermore perhaps I can give you, and everyone else some insight on n54 start up? :)
I can confirm it takes more than just the CAS, and Key in order to get start up from an n54 engine, regardless of MSD versions, which is okay! This is just a full electrical swap, rather than seeking a way around the EWS system, which right now would take development on ones end to "crack" the dme as past version have been done. This has proven difficult.

I won't get too indepth but for several reasons but, you'll want to take everything off of a single donor vehicle; One reason being the security measure used to prevent theft, which involves 5 modules, not including the cluster, or keys; these modules need to be on the same electronic "combination" in order for wake up signals to run continuous.

We can conclude there is more needed for start up with this info on the IBS, which is the Battery module you speak of, without it, you are infact grounding out on the terminal, thus the dme wont receive a wake up signal resulting in a no start, or if you dont register your battery, the dme will adopt a newr value at idle, as explained below.

IBS:
A fault code is stored in the DME when the IBS is defective. The DME adopts a substitute value and assumes IBS emergency mode. IBS emergency mode boosts the idle speed in order to sufficiently charge the battery.
Direct diagnosis of the IBS is not possible, it can only be diagnosed
through the DME. The self diagnosis function checks the voltage, current, temperature, terminal 15 wake up signal as well as system errors in the IBS.

Note: The software in the DME and that of the IBS must match. To ensure this requirement, it may be necessary to replace the IBS in connection with a software update.

Voltage Measurement:If the IBS is shorted to ground, a DME fault code will display “Voltage Fault DME ON”.
The IBS will be unable to wake up the DME.

The only module I wont be using is the FRM, which cntrols all things auxiliary Lights,main lighting, doors, seats,display, drive, heater/ac, ETC

I will be using the E90 cluster for sure, and I'll pricing out a 335i gas tank, because who doesn't want a plastic gas tank that is also PNP with the rest of the system :)

you're talking about the CAN module. technically, you could do without it - however, you wouldn't be able to connect an OBD2 port to the DME which wouldn't be a good idea. all the "wake up" signal does is send a 12v signal to the DME. I actually use an E60 CAN module for bench testing/flashing which talks to a whole bunch of DMEs (MSV70, MSV80, MSD80, MSS60, MSS65, and I presume MSS70).

otherwise you really only need the CAS module and that's only because at present, I don't know of an EWS delete (although I'm sure one is out there). With the CAN module and an RPM input, the DME will "run" the engine but it will not fire the injector or ignition drivers so the engine would never start. the CAS module basically enables them, and on the E90, the ignition switch also passes through it to the starter (a moot point on the E30).

if you've got an entire car though, yeah, you're going to want to swap over basically the entire harness/electronics, including the ABS and the gas tank.

[the imitator]

Thanks man!! Wont be long till im back at it!

[Old city bimmer]

Are you still looking for brown tinted glass?

Yes sir.


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[the imitator]

you're talking about the CAN module. technically, you could do without it - however, you wouldn't be able to connect an OBD2 port to the DME which wouldn't be a good idea. all the "wake up" signal does is send a 12v signal to the DME. I actually use an E60 CAN module for bench testing/flashing which talks to a whole bunch of DMEs (MSV70, MSV80, MSD80, MSS60, MSS65, and I presume MSS70).

otherwise you really only need the CAS module and that's only because at present, I don't know of an EWS delete (although I'm sure one is out there). With the CAN module and an RPM input, the DME will "run" the engine but it will not fire the injector or ignition drivers so the engine would never start. the CAS module basically enables them, and on the E90, the ignition switch also passes through it to the starter (a moot point on the E30).

if you've got an entire car though, yeah, you're going to want to swap over basically the entire harness/electronics, including the ABS and the gas tank.

I'm sorry Nando but there must be some misunderstanding on someones end here, unless bmw changed things up. Through hours and hours of research, no there is no ews delete available for the N54, as mentioned before, these modules are on an "eletronic tumbler" of sorts, if you dont have the EWS it cannot read the combination since the EWS is the home for security, EVEN the EWS needs a wake up signal to get start up.

Which CAN line do you want, and what are you referring to as the CAN module? There is not such a thing on the 335i unless we are talking about th FRM which utilizes the CANBUS for brake lights, headlights,windows, heated seats ETC.

PT-CAN High
PT-CAN Low
LIN BUS
K-CAN High
K-CAN Low
MOST
BSD Line

BMW defines as a Master controller which provides wake up signals, and operating voltages to subscribing modules. What information are you gathering off your bench testing unit? are you able to access, checksum data, and tables? or is it more or less for just flashing? I'm a little confused as I have a K-Dcan cable that can read just about every single thing on the msd80, and much much more.

I am referring to the CAS as your are, The only thing CAN related that goes to the OBD port, is a CAN high, and CAN low, but they are twisted lines that created a frequency through opposing signals, but they still travel to every module, they dont head straight back to a "address" they run continuous through out the car.

Aside from the 4 wake up signals between modules, start up signal, signal terminal 15 which goes to junction box, and the STARTER, and a few grounds, it is vital to keep the communication intact with the DME,EWS,CAS,Cluster, the ekm and other modules are also controlled by CAN but you can swap these between 335i models.

There are 4 wake up signals that go to vital parts of the car in order receive start up. The reason BMW uses a CANBUS eletrical system is for the speed in transferring data, which is at 500K/bps, but the CAN is not a specific module, it is actually between EVERY module. It is essentially the lines for communication. CANBUS is the electrical system BMW uses.

All of these control certain functions, but are also lines of communication to other Modules, the module sees the specific can Code, and if it doesnt recognize it, the command is ignored, and it moves to the next module. very quickly.

http://www.e38.org/bussystem.pdf

Thanks for the insight Nando

[nando]

there is a CAN module. The E60 / E90 and similar era models are organized differently from earlier CAN enabled BMWs. I don't remember what it's called on the E90, but it's centralized (it think it might be the FRM, actually).

It also sends the wake up signal to the DME. if you just hook the CAN signals from the DME straight to the OBD port, it won't work. I've tried it. All of the CAN signals get sent to the centralized module, and that module communicates with the OBD port.

I understand there isn't a public EWS delete for MSD80 (I even said that). What I was saying is, you don't need the CAS for the starter engagement. the E30 ignition switch goes straight to the starter, it doesn't need to route through an EWS module. the only thing you truly need the CAS for is to enable the injector and ignition output stages.

If there was an EWS delete, you wouldn't need the CAS at all. Aside from the modules for the fuel pump and battery, you'd only need the DME & CAN interface.

it would be cool to be able to use the start button & electronic wheel lock though. are you swapping steering columns too? even better if the car had comfort access and you could hook up all the antennas..

[the imitator]

otherwise you really only need the CAS module and that's only because at present, I don't know of an EWS delete (although I'm sure one is out there).

guess I took you a little to literal there, I apologize.

Please take a gander at the picture below, it will save us some time.
Using the e30 ignition for starting purposes simply won't work, the JBE must see everything that is in orange/black (PT CAN), if it does not see/receive a signal, or command the car will not have start up, period.

You can see that that the FRM is bypassed, which is why I am deleting it. Please look further down and you see the CAS2 is looped back to the instrument cluster. The cluster is needed, just as much as the CAS,DME, and JBE, ekp, and other modules.

The reason why it appears to be a reorganization is due to different cars receiving different packages, cold weather, sports, comfort ETC.

The more, and more we speak I feel we are talking about the JBE. It is more or less an intersection for information to be spread, taken, addressed and then made into a Checksum. Not just a Home base, where information gets stored, and only delivers wake up signals to the DME, that just isn't fully true.

Nando, I am indeed using the push button start, and key fob/port from the 335i, but e30 column simply because I dont need the 335i unit at all. the 335i ignition goes to terminal 15+/starter upon command, which is fused and associated with relays within the system. Won't be difficult. As far as lighting goes, I can simply use the stock e30 key, and ignition for creature comforts, lighting, music etc. I can even run it on a seperate power supply if I wish.

This may be COOL! In theory, If I can get my hands on a pair of Tesla Rear Calipers that incorporates KERS, the way the IBS works, it would still read the power supply coming off the systemas it would an altnerator, Would be neat to do a Alternator delete. lol

This picture should help with my explanation, It's isnt hard to see that in order for this system to run serially it must go through each module one by one, this isn't as simple as previous swaps. The JBE in the very utmost simple form plugs into 4 things, 1.Engine/start related bus lines, 2.FRM, and AUX associated bus lines, 3. The instrument Cluster 4. runs to F-CAN lines, DSC and a couple other functions which will show error on the cluser, but can be taken out with ease. that is all.

In this case, a picture does more than words, you need more than the CAS, and matching key though, that is for fact, without the JBE there would be no way for the CANBUS system to ever communicate, I've provided additional information on the IBS, and other systems in regards to start up.

[the imitator]

Yes sir.


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Well there are some on fleabay uk, for 50 bucks a pane brotha.

[Old city bimmer]

Yeah I saw that. Thanks.


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[the imitator]

Well wtf m8, that is where I'm getting all my deals for now!

[G-Man the Visionary]

So... We haven't spoke in a while, but I really like the news. This is awesome! Hope you see it through this time because that's gonna be one sweeeet ride!