NA is best - 3.1L M20 w/ ITB's

[digger]

MS2 hardly has any of that stuff. MS3 has some of it. But even then, some of the features MS3 offers such as it's closed loop knock control is next to useless.

Look at Link or Emtron and compare the features. The info is out there.


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you dont need closed look knock control on a NA m20, nor do you need e-throttle, vanos control and other things that the big names are bringing out / developing further that add cost but offer little real benefit for this application.

for sure the name brand stuff does the simple things better and more robustly but MS is will be able to run the engine perfectly well if its tuned correctly so its a question of budget

[berlow94]

you dont need closed look knock control on a NA m20, nor do you need e-throttle, vanos control and other things that the big names are bringing out and developing further that add cost but offer little real benefit for this application.

for sure the name brand stuff does the simple things better and more robustly but MS is will be able to run the engine perfectly well if its tuned correctly so its a question of budget

I understand and agree with you. But, the beauty of standalone ECU's is that they are universally compatible.
Say you want to build or run a boosted S54 down the road? Or maybe even a supercharged LSx swap?
MS CAN'T handle that! Link sells an ECU for the same price as MS3 that CAN handle that!
Why not spend the money once? Rather than having to pay for hardware and software upgrades down the road? You end up saving money and getting better reliability going with a name brand.

MS made a name for themselves as being the DIY solution. At the time, there wasn't any competition at that price point. That's not the case anymore though!!!


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[2mAn]

How are you guys getting close to or above 100 torque per liter at the crank?

I think the M20s are pretty underrated/ understressed from the factory.They gave them lower compression for longevity, but add compression to the mix and all of a sudden you get a significant increase in power.

My (aluminum) M52 only has OBD1 manifolds and S52 cams and it put 225whp down which is a conservative 265bhp. I havent even developed a good exhaust system and the intake side is a joke too, all oem.

Im really excited to see what this car makes, and I agree the tune will make all the difference in the world.

[digger]

I understand and agree with you. But, the beauty of standalone ECU's is that they are universally compatible.
Say you want to build or run a boosted S54 down the road? Or maybe even a supercharged LSx swap?
MS CAN'T handle that! Link sells an ECU for the same price as MS3 that CAN handle that!
Why not spend the money once? Rather than having to pay for hardware and software upgrades down the road? You end up saving money and getting better reliability going with a name brand.

MS made a name for themselves as being the DIY solution. At the time, there wasn't any competition at that price point. That's not the case anymore though!!!


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when time comes for other projects there will be even better solutions out there and at a reduced price so i dont subscribe to the "but i can use it for something else down the line".

[mila325]

when time comes for other projects there will be even better solutions out there and at a reduced price so i dont subscribe to the "but i can use it for something else down the line".

Hey digger, do you have any opinions on the EMU ECU? Rama seems to praise it quite a lot, and I'm not sure if that's because he's got a sponsorship or if it is a great alternative to MS/Haltech/things 3x it's price.

[digger]

looks easy to use and configure. ive not used it myself, though have downloaded the software to look at its capabilities. i think it did everything youd need on a NA m20 from memory and this was a couple years back so they might have a newer version

[digger]

How are you guys getting close to or above 100 torque per liter at the crank?

realistically they probably arent, going from chassis dyno to crank numbers as can of worms

[econti]

Hey digger, do you have any opinions on the EMU ECU? Rama seems to praise it quite a lot, and I'm not sure if that's because he's got a sponsorship or if it is a great alternative to MS/Haltech/things 3x it's price.

I personally rate it as good for race cars but not as good for street cars as a Haltech.

[bmwmaster81]

Im using EMU with m20 since some time and can tell it is worth every penny.
There isnt much difference to the other (more expensive) ECUs.

Ist capable to run NA and Turbo and has a lot of Features.
Knock control, Boost contrao, traction control, NOS.

Im running my m20 with Ramas ITBs, retrofitted knock control, Wasted Spark as an example.

Everything works great with EMU.
Also you have an LSU4.2 WBO Controller so just connect an Bosch 4.2 Lambda sensor and you are ready to go.

[digger]

I personally rate it as good for race cars but not as good for street cars as a Haltech.

If I was to ever shell out for another ecu, the haltech elite 750 is probably the one I'd consider.

[berlow94]

That Haltech Elite 750 looks great! Very comparable to the Link ECU I mentioned before.


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[Hubry]

Gonna be very curious to see how this works out.

Just a question because this is something I'd like to do in the future:

How does the ECU get an accurate airflow/pressure reading? It looks like this kit does away with the AFM sensor so it probably relies on some kind of Alpha N setup. Couldn't this potentially mess with things if you drive to a lower altitude?

[econti]

I've got an Elite 750 in my R32 Skyline and its a spectacular bit of kit. Perfect for a M20.

Gonna be very curious to see how this works out.

Just a question because this is something I'd like to do in the future:

How does the ECU get an accurate airflow/pressure reading? It looks like this kit does away with the AFM sensor so it probably relies on some kind of Alpha N setup. Couldn't this potentially mess with things if you drive to a lower altitude?

If a standalone ECU doesn't use a MAP sensor its not worth anything IMO

[nomansland92]

+1 on the haltech, been using there elite series for my m20 and it's world's apart from megasquirt. The software is excellent and the ability to expand is endless. Plus using there CAN wide band is a nice piece of mind compared to a 0-5v.

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[litu]

Wow, awesome project...That engine, i would want in my e30