Mercedes 190e??

[BrooklynMW]

It's hard to find one that isn't either way overpriced or hasn't been completely abused. I should know, I've been looking.
And manuals? The only ones I see are earier models, '84-86, which are heavy, slow and sluggish.
The later models, 89-93, be it 2.3 or 2.6 are a bit more zippy due to higher compression.
They're fun to drive and comfortable as as a cloud to sit in. However, even though they're right around the same size as an e30, they feel a whole lot larger. Classic German tank.
Think of it as the lovechild of an e30 and a Volvo station wagon.

That said, if you can find a clean one for around $3000, go for it. Suggest sticking to later models.

[stamar]

I have seen auto 190es for sale for dirt cheap actually.

love mercedes seats cannot be beat. blows the e30 away for these years.

Im not feelin love for automatic mercedes though thats boring. I think Id rather have a manual honda.

great if you want to get in a head on collision though definitely.

[Emre]

As a long time E30 M3 and 190E 2,3-16 fan, all I'm going I say is that both cars are badass. I would love to have the aftermarket support that the M3 has; the flip side is that it's cool driving something different.

As for the argument that a stock 325is is faster than a 16v (or that a new Golf GTI is faster than an E30 M3), my answer is so what? An Escort RS Cosworth is slower, less reliable, and more expensive to mod than an '03 WRX. Which one is cooler? The same can be said for the Lancia Delta HF Infegrale, Renault 5 Turbo, Peugeot 205 Mi16, Ur Quattro, and Sierra Cosworth. Which would you rather have in your garage...one of them, or a new Civic Type R?

Me? I love the M3, but I'll take the 16v. Here are shots of my 16v from GFest '12 and NJMP-Lightning last weekend:

[KamakaziX]

I love both cars. Snitch is a dumbass though. Yes, power isn't everything. And yes, cozzies are faster than a 325i. Take it from someone who has driven both. I loved the cosworth. By far one of the coolest cars I've ever driven. However, it wasn't a lot of fun to drive. It's driving position was awkward and my 87 325i with cheap aftermarket shocks and struts was more fun to drive in the twisties. Fwiw, the cozzies had billies and H&R springs. That said, with it's posi rear end, that car was really fun sideways. B) Cozzies are kind of big feeling, but they are SO cool.

[Snitch]

Any ways back to the OP topic.

Finding a 190 in manual is hard, however they do pop up. Check on 190rev.net, usually there are some for sale. As far as Cosworths go, they are typically easy to find in manual but many of them are trashed so be careful. I paid 6k for mine and sold it for 10k and it was in fair condition, just to give you an idea. Parts are very expensive for a 16V so keep that in mind.

[1984eta]

I found this on clist last night, looks like a good deal?

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/csd/cto/3035795257.html

[reelizmpro]

Not enough info on the actual car. Looks nice though.

[KamakaziX]

Dat chrome.

[JA1991]

I just want to stick to German cars. My gf has been bugging me to help her find something. I plan on owning a cosworth one day. I'll probably find her something else now that i've looked into how much stuff costs and what not.
I thank you guys for all your input

[Fusion]

The 190/E30 comparison is a absurd. Though tight competitors on the DTM track, production cars each had their own territory. The (later) AMG cars were and still are a luxury business vehicle that can be fun, the ///M cars are fun and can be used as a luxury business vehicle. Proof being the lack of manual gearboxes in the AMGs, lack of sporty coupes, the E500, and AMGs being much more comfortable and "easier" to drive.
And don't forget that the 190 was Merc's return to motorsport model, It didn't have predecessors like the E21 and 2002.

Neither is better, each has its own category of drivers.

And the 16Vs aren't all comparable to the M3, the ones above are more like a 320is, just not that valuable.

If you're serious, get an evolution I or II.

[JA1991]

haha i don't think i have the money for an Evo...

[Emre]

And the 16Vs aren't all comparable to the M3, the ones above are more like a 320is, just not that valuable.

If you're an enthusiast, you don't really care how the car performs in 100% stock form. When was the last time you saw a stock E30 M3 on the track? If you want to have fun with these cars, you need to mod them.

The fastest M3's in club racing are extensively modded, including cup-under lifter conversions, cams, intake system, and engine management. Do similar mods to a 190E 2,3-16 and the cars are VERY evenly matched. Just look at the ADAC 24h and VLN series, where 2,5-16's consistently outperform E30 M3's.

My 16v still has a 100% stock engine with single flapper throttle and K-Jet. Makes under 170 hp. With just suspension work (Ground Control), big brakes (Evo II Brembos), and decent wheels and tires (Yoko AO48 on Evo I alloys) I was keeping up with and passing all of the E30's, most of the E30 M3's, and many of the E36 M3's running in the instructor group af NJMP-Lightning last weekend. Once the race engine goes in and all the excess weight comes out, it will be a beast.

[Fusion]

Yes, but you can do that to a Dodge Neon too.
The point is that a 2.3 16v isn't "ranked" as high in the Mercedes family as an M3 at BMWs.

[M42Power]

Here in europe 190's are like crown vics in the us, they will never get rid of the slow boring taxi reputation.

[Snitch]

Yes, but you can do that to a Dodge Neon too.
The point is that a 2.3 16v isn't "ranked" as high in the Mercedes family as an M3 at BMWs.

What the hell is that supposed to mean. The 190 was known as Mercedes best car ever made... and the 2.3-16v, how is it not ranked as high? What fucking ranking system are you going off of? No shit you could mod a Dodge Neon... It would also out perform a E90 M3.

The 190-16v is not comparable to the E30 M3 in what way? Horsepower and a stiffer suspension?
Nothing a Turbo or coil overs couldn't change

Its the people like you that piss me off. Do you not understand BMW and Mercedes have different clients? BMW designs their cars to be sporty for the arrogant teenage mid 20's asshole while Mercedes has luxury and class and markets more towards older and comfort seeking clients. But wait, the BMW handles better so its a better car. Hold on lets fucking think for a second.... Your driving on the street with pedestrians and traffic, what should you do? Be a bad ass and think your Nico Rosberg in your F1 Car and drive like a dumb ass? Point being, who fucking cares if it handles better your driving on the fucking road. The difference is so minimal that you would only notice it on a track which NO ONE WILL EVER TAKE STOCK CARS TO (unless your an idiot.)

Typical BMW owners. Now please say something in response so I can tear your asshole again.