Global Warming: What do you think? What do you know?

[Scotaku]

Half a generation ago during the 70's, guess what the climate topic of the day was?
Global Cooling.

(gasp)

The current hysteria over global climate is heavily skewed by the only recent availability of technology that has provided the data todays assertions are being based upon. We have uncommonly high resolution now that did not exist even ten years ago, but we are being led to believe this data represents a much larger lice of history. The fact is, we don't have enough data collected over time to make most if not all of the scary predictions out there. Ice caps melting. Polar bears dying. El Niño. La Niña.

The responsible thing to do is to continue collecting data and making cautious recommendations like composting, recycling, cleaner energy sources, etc. The scare tactics selling Priuses is good only for Toyota. For all we know, the planet rides on a frequency we don't live long enough to experience the highs and lows of.

[Maluco]

Props Texas!

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080717/D91VR9N80.html

In what experts say is the biggest investment in the clean and renewable energy in U.S. history, utility officials in the Lone Star State gave preliminary approval Thursday to a $4.9 billion plan to build new transmission lines to carry wind-generated electricity from gusty West Texas to urban areas like Dallas.

"People think about oil wells and football in Texas, but in 10 years they'll look back and say this was a brilliant thing to do," said Patrick Woodson, vice president of E.On Climate & Renewables North America, which has about 1,200 megawatts of wind projects already in use or on the drawing board in Texas.

Texas is already the national leader in wind power, generating about 5,000 megawatts. But wind-energy advocates say the lack of transmission lines has kept a lot of that power from being put to use and has hindered the building of more turbines.

[CorvallisBMW]

Props Texas!

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080717/D91VR9N80.html

In what experts say is the biggest investment in the clean and renewable energy in U.S. history, utility officials in the Lone Star State gave preliminary approval Thursday to a $4.9 billion plan to build new transmission lines to carry wind-generated electricity from gusty West Texas to urban areas like Dallas.

"People think about oil wells and football in Texas, but in 10 years they'll look back and say this was a brilliant thing to do," said Patrick Woodson, vice president of E.On Climate & Renewables North America, which has about 1,200 megawatts of wind projects already in use or on the drawing board in Texas.

Texas is already the national leader in wind power, generating about 5,000 megawatts. But wind-energy advocates say the lack of transmission lines has kept a lot of that power from being put to use and has hindered the building of more turbines.

Holy crap, you mean Texas acutally did something right? Wow, it's a strange new world ;)

[Ral]

I just saw on the news there's a town in Missouri that recently witched over to full wind power. If there's no wind they buy from traditional forms, but so far they've ended up selling surplus energy to surrounding towns. saw it on the Communist News Network, so no linkey.

[Maluco]

Norway donates up to one billion dollars for Brazilian rain forest.

"To win the battle against global warming, we have to win the fight against global deforestation," the Norwegian leader.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080916/sc_afp/brazilnorwayenvironment_080916211355

[Maluco]

let's see if some of you have changed your thoughts...

[mrsleeve]

I have not still the same ol BS as it was 6 months ago

[joshh]

Money maker.

[Wiglaf]

being sustainable is going to become a much larger problem than if global warming is real or not.. our population and resource use is already pushing some real-world limits. With China and other industrial countries using more like we do, we will hit a wall and the price of things will go waaay up. and it will happen in my lifetime.
becoming more efficient is just a smart thing to do, and will save money in the long run as energy prices increase.

and no matter if we caused it or not, the ice caps melting will cause the sea level to rise a bit, and the temperature to rise quicker. 1ft of higher water doesn't sound like a big deal but if you're anywhere near sea level than it can have big impacts.

[Maluco]

Tha Saga Continues...

taxy tax tax...




House Democrats win key test vote on climate bill

Jun 26 12:03 PM US/Eastern
By H. JOSEF HEBERT and DINA CAPPIELLO
Associated Press Writers


WASHINGTON (AP) - House Democrats narrowly won a key test vote Friday on sweeping legislation to combat global warming and usher in a new era of cleaner energy. Republicans said the bill included "the largest tax increase in American history."
The vote was 217-205 to advance the White House-backed legislation to the floor, and 30 Democrats defected, a reflection of the controversy the bill sparked.
The legislation would impose limits for the first time on carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gas pollution from power plants, factories and refineries. It also would force a shift from coal and other fossil fuels to renewable and more efficient forms of energy. Supporters and opponents agreed the result would be higher energy costs, but disagreed widely on the impact on consumers.
President Barack Obama has made the measure a top priority of his first year in office. The president, along with White House aides and House Democratic leaders, scrambled for the votes to assure passage. Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., has pledged to get the legislation passed before lawmakers leave on their July 4 vacation.
The Senate has yet to act on the measure, and a major struggle is expected.
In the House, the bill's fate depended on the decisions of a few dozen fence-sitting Democrats, mainly conservatives and moderates from contested districts who feared the political ramifications of siding with the White House and their leadership on the measure.
Democrats left little or nothing to chance. Rep. Ellen Tauscher, D-Calif., confirmed by the Senate on Thursday to an administration post, put off her resignation from Congress until after the final vote on the climate change bill.
"The bill contains provisions to protect consumers, keep costs low, help sensitive industries transition to a clean energy economy and promote domestic emission reduction efforts," the White House in a statement of support for the legislation.
Republicans saw it differently.
This "amounts to the largest tax increase in American history under the guise of climate change," said Rep. Mike Pence, R-Ind.
While the bill would impose a "cap-and-trade" system that would force higher energy costs, Republicans for weeks have branded it an energy tax on every American.
But Rep. Jim McGovern, D-Mass., said there was a "moral imperative to be good stewards of the earth."
The legislation, totaling about 1,200 pages, would require the U.S. to reduce carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gas emissions by 17 percent from 2005 levels by 2020 and about 80 percent by the next century.
U.S. carbon dioxide emissions from the burning of fossil fuels are rising at about 1 percent a year and are predicted to continue increasing without mandatory caps.
Under the bill, the government would limit heat-trapping pollution from factories, refineries and power plants. It would distribute pollution allowances that could be bought and sold, depending on whether a facility exceeds the cap or makes greater pollution cuts than are required.
Obama on Thursday called it "a vote of historic proportions ... that will open the door to a clean energy economy" and green jobs. "It will create millions of new jobs," Pelosi insisted.
Both Obama and Pelosi preferred to focus on the economic issues rather than on what environmentalists view as the urgency of reducing carbon emissions blamed for global warming.
The Rust Belt coal-state Democrats who have been sitting on the fence worry about how to explain their vote for higher energy prices to people back home—and how the vote might play out in elections next year.
Republicans have been quick to exploit those concerns.
"Democratic leaders are poised to march many moderate Democrats over a cliff ... by forcing them to vote for a national energy tax that is unpopular throughout the heartland," Republican leader John Boehner of Ohio said.
There was widespread agreement that under this cap-and-trade system, the cost of energy would almost certainly increase. But Democrats argued that much of the impact on taxpayers would be offset by other provisions in the bill. Low-income consumers would qualify for credits and rebates to cushion the impact on their energy bills.
Two reports issued this week—one from the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office and the other from the Environmental Protection Agency—seemed to support that argument.
The CBO analysis estimated that the bill would cost an average household $175 a year; the EPA put it at between $80 and $110 a year.
Republicans questioned the validity of the CBO study and noted that even that analysis showed actual energy production costs increasing $770 per household. Industry groups have cited other studies showing much higher cost to the economy and to individuals.
___
On the Net:
American Clean Energy and Security Act: http://tinyurl.com/ph52vs
Copyright 2009 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

[z31maniac]

There is another article on WSJ online that is good as well.

[BigD]

Don't care to check all the pages, so I dunno if this has been posted, but it's a worthwhile watch for anyone that's watched Gore's movie:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=288952680655100870

[mrsleeve]

Like I have said Umpteen times in the this thread human induced GW is a crock of shit.


And OH boy if this thing get past the senate, you watch the price of everything from fuel to play stations go through the fucking roof due to all the new taxes.

[nando]

1974 called, they want their politicians back

[gazellebeigem3]

Supporters and opponents agreed the result would be higher energy costs, but disagreed widely on the impact on consumers.

Are the people that thought it wouldnt impact consumers high on fucking crack? Considering the energy market is based on speculation, everythings going to go through the roof!

Gas already gets jacked up when a refinery worker in the middle east has a slip and fall and has to miss work for a couple of days.