Sick Rantorum

[Fusion]

- Kill = illegal. Not just bad, but illegal.
- Punishment to be worthy, and not worse than the crime.
- Every person is born with inalienable rights.
- No discrimination.
- Justice/ not revenge.

Interestíng fact: Just about every religion (or believers therof) has broken these "rules", not only individuals, but on a huge scale. The Bible very carefully states when it is "legal" to do so, contradicting itself and its own original message.

So if it were up to me, I'd choose representatives, who value common sense higher than an old fairy tale.

[Sailor37]

This guy is such a fucktard. I think everyone voting for Obama should be disallowed to vote, and candidate that mentions god should be immediately dismissed from running for any form of government.

ftfy

[mar1t1me]

You seem to be at least somewhat educated, so I don't understand how this is so hard to understand: mormonism DENIES core beliefs of Christianity, ergo, there is no way for it to be a "Christian religion". Thats like saying Islam is the same as Christianity because the Islamics claim to be from Moses.

I totally get the difference, and frankly, since Mormons believe that the idea of salvation through Jesus is essentially a distracting lie planted by Satan, can't believe people who act like having a non-Christian in the White House would be the end of the US entertain Mormon candidates. I really don't care, except that the less about religion I hear from a candidate, the more likely I am to listen to him/her.

See why this is not worth debating online?

Truly! Religion, also known as "my God can beat up your God" needs to go if we, this child race of humans is ever to grow past our pathetically superstitious current state.

[Dozyproductions]

Some of the ones I can think of off the top of my head, may be debatable in the sense that some people think they are what you could call "natural" laws. And today, these are obviously not unique anymore, but when the Bible was written.

- Kill = illegal. Not just bad, but illegal.
- Punishment to be worthy, and not worse than the crime.
- Every person is born with inalienable rights.
- No discrimination.
- Justice/ not revenge.

And not trying to sound condescending to the least but christian ethics/morals can be found in a multitude of pagan cultures. Have you heard of Hammurabi, Confucius, Lao-tse, Buddha, Socrates, Epicurus, or Spinoza? There are scores of others but just because Christianity embraced them doesn't mean its the source.

Morality can definitely exist outside of Christianity and the argument my friends always bring up is with Christianity; at least there is something there to put you in check. It's rubbish and slightly offensive when some one is telling me that basically I lack the integrity, since I don't know Christ, to have morals.

The one thing that iffs me is how politicians will pretend to be of the faith and then use the justified killing idea on a grand scale all in while just picking profits from multi natural corporations. It doesn't make true believers look good, which in my point is hard to do anyways, not including the dogma.

It sucks because this on going system of an economic global empire is spun on the news to brain wash us that it's good and some how enables weaker preachers and congregations to justify what very well could be the workings of the devil. This is coming from a person who is forced to go to sunday school and church every sunday.

edit: sorry for sounding snobby but I have a fever and I live in a van down by the river.

[ck_taft325is]

you are correct.




well the religious right in this country have gone coo coo for cocoa puffs and they use their beliefs to force legislation on others. That's just shitty and why people are cautious about electing religious nutties. Funny how hollow this amendment is.

Kind of like letting the lack of religion dictate who is credible and who is not based on the assumption that they are all Coo coo? The shoe fits on both feet if you really think about it.

[ck_taft325is]

They certainly didn't talk about it like they do now. At that time, for a man to say his running was "God's Will" or that when in office he would "do God's Will" would have been simply promoting another man's tyranny.

Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed by inserting "Jesus Christ," so that it would read "A departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;" the insertion was rejected by the great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mohammedan, the Hindoo and Infidel of every denomination.

-Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, in reference to the Virginia Act for Religious Freedom

And these from the same author:

History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes.

Christianity neither is, nor ever was a part of the common law.

-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Dr. Thomas Cooper, February 10, 1814


It's clear that the people who think this country was founded as a Christian one are drinking Draino......

Who said Christianity? Separation of Church and State doesn't explicitly or even remotely mean Christianity. Unless you can acknowledge this overt bent against Christians then there's nothing really to talk about, right?

While I am a Christian, I never said Christianity. Even Benjamin Franklin who was known as a strong opponent to Christianity acknowledged that there must be a higher power.

Somewhat relate, the morals imbedded in our country's law are based, or at least resemble that of basic, Christian principles.

Bingo.

It's not the Law's themselves but the fundamentals that drive them. Some of the most Christian-esce people I've ever met don't believe in God. Go figure. For the Bible hater's and anti-Christian nutto's, you should like this: The Bible itself says that a vast majority border lining on near all of professing followers of God and Christ alike will be left out of heaven. So, a grain of salt should be taken to people's words about God or Christ or their Faith in either. Start looking at their actions. Or even better, stop giving such a giant fuck and move on. Live your life. Stop forcing your same beliefs onto everyone else about someone else's beliefs. I'm sure we can all find a better way to spend our time, yeah?

[z31maniac]

Stop forcing your same beliefs onto everyone else about someone else's beliefs.

That's precisely what has the non-christians upset.

Santorum has stated, on the record, he thinks the gov't should be involved in people's personal lives and in their bedrooms.

[Dozyproductions]

Kind of like letting the lack of religion dictate who is credible and who is not based on the assumption that they are all Coo coo? The shoe fits on both feet if you really think about it.

Nice spin but no. Im going to vote for Ron Paul. I don't agree with him on his stance of abortion, which is clearly dictated by his religion. He is going to get my vote anyways because I know he won't use his religion as a divider to can be added to explain the misguided political polarity of this country.

As long as there is a conceived monumental division of among American this shit two party system can keep on voting for the same exact shit with little notice from the public. ugh. Fever has not gone down.

[Dozyproductions]

Stop forcing your same beliefs onto everyone else about someone else's beliefs. I'm sure we can all find a better way to spend our time, yeah?

That get's me upset too because the 1st ammendment doesn't say shit about shit in that regard. In San Diego they wanted to take down the cross on Mt. Soledad and that would of been a huge diservice to the military men who died during the korean war. That's comparable to the story of a lawyer from San Diego who went in a wheel chair up to Julian, far and remote little town in the mountains nearby, and sued every business there was that didn't have a wheelchair ramp, not for the sake of other wheelchair users but because he saw the dollar signs in such actions.

But I will counter that with my living situation. My landlord recently figured out that I've been meditating using certain sounds to help me with the process. Being uber religious she forbade me from using the sounds on the grounds that she doesn't want eastern religious values taking control of her house and inviting demons, because as she said it happened to a friend. As a non believer how am I to counter such a claim? Santorum uses similar non logical ( logic can be used to explain christianity) arguments; not to cleanse the morality of bulwark of western civilization but as a tool, for money and power. It's simple to see through and all you have to do to determine the justifications is to see the results.

[mar1t1me]

But I will counter that with my living situation. My landlord recently figured out that I've been meditating using certain sounds to help me with the process. Being uber religious she forbade me from using the sounds on the grounds that she doesn't want eastern religious values taking control of her house and inviting demons, because as she said it happened to a friend. As a non believer how am I to counter such a claim?

You can't. Because if logic and reason worked on religious people, there would be no religious people. Maybe you should hang one of those blue-eyed, blond Jesus pictures in your room and tell that's who you are focusing on when you meditate.

People like her are nucking futz......I once worked for a guy who claimed that yoga was a religion. I suppose it is to some people, haha, but he was really threatened by the idea of yoga classes being taught in town. It was inviting evil, he said. Oooof.

Santorum uses similar non logical ( logic can be used to explain christianity) arguments; not to cleanse the morality of bulwark of western civilization but as a tool, for money and power. It's simple to see through and all you have to do to determine the justifications is to see the results.

See prior comment about religious people and reason..... people like Santorum don't have sufficient faith, so they try to "prove" their assertions. But as our esteemed Mr. Jefferson said more than 200 years ago,

"Priests...dread the advance of science as witches do the approach of daylight and scowl on the fatal harbinger announcing the subversions of the duperies on which they live."

[FunfGan]

Truly! Religion, also known as "my God can beat up your God" needs to go if we, this child race of humans is ever to grow past our pathetically superstitious current state.

You're doing the same exact thing my friend. Atheism is, in all ways, a religion. It is a set of beliefs, and how you live your life. You're saying that your beliefs trump my, or any other person on here's beliefs. Thats any different than if I were to try to trump my religion over say, an Islamic man or Jew?

[mar1t1me]

Who said Christianity? Separation of Church and State doesn't explicitly or even remotely mean Christianity. Unless you can acknowledge this overt bent against Christians then there's nothing really to talk about, right?

I was referring to the ideas put forth by the majority of GOP candidates that the US was founded as a Christian nation. Since the nation IS in their opinion a Christian one, and the government was also, in their opinion, founded on Christian law, then a separation is both redundant and unnecessary.

I believe Kennedy had it right when he painted the picture of a table at which were seated all faiths equally, but upon the table would be no one symbol of any particular religion. However, since religions must continually attest that theirs is the only true religion and all other Gods are false, such an alliance is a practical impossibility.

[FunfGan]

And not trying to sound condescending to the least but christian ethics/morals can be found in a multitude of pagan cultures. Have you heard of Hammurabi, Confucius, Lao-tse, Buddha, Socrates, Epicurus, or Spinoza? There are scores of others but just because Christianity embraced them doesn't mean its the source.

Morality can definitely exist outside of Christianity and the argument my friends always bring up is with Christianity; at least there is something there to put you in check. It's rubbish and slightly offensive when some one is telling me that basically I lack the integrity, since I don't know Christ, to have morals.

The one thing that iffs me is how politicians will pretend to be of the faith and then use the justified killing idea on a grand scale all in while just picking profits from multi natural corporations. It doesn't make true believers look good, which in my point is hard to do anyways, not including the dogma.

It sucks because this on going system of an economic global empire is spun on the news to brain wash us that it's good and some how enables weaker preachers and congregations to justify what very well could be the workings of the devil. This is coming from a person who is forced to go to sunday school and church every sunday.

edit: sorry for sounding snobby but I have a fever and I live in a van down by the river.

Did not mean to offend you in one way or another. And don't get me wrong, I believe that Athiests, or followers of any other religion can have just as good and true morals as a Christian. My only point in that post was that, if you look at it, most of the "religious" Founding fathers in one way another traced themselves back to a "Bible" religion. In which I mean to point towards the strong chance (or fact) that the constitution and preceding/ closely following documents would be inspired by the Bible.

I wholly agree with you that anybody can be moral and good. In fact, most people who claim to be(or even are) Christians are most of the time not as good. That is the point. We all do wrong, and must admit that we do wrong. Being a true Christian does not make one perfect by any means.

And as I said before, nothing I said is meant to offend, or attack.

[mar1t1me]

You're doing the same exact thing my friend. Atheism is, in all ways, a religion. It is a set of beliefs, and how you live your life. You're saying that your beliefs trump my, or any other person on here's beliefs. Thats any different than if I were to try to trump my religion over say, an Islamic man or Jew?

Here's the difference:

I am not bound by dogma and preordained beliefs. I am not superstitious. I welcome free thinking and open inquiry.

Those are three things that the major revealed monotheisms are very uncomfortable with. How many thousands of steps backwards will religion have to take before it realizes how utterly irrelevant and impotent it has become? It used to be a handy explanation for all things, but we have watched scientific inquiry, notwithstanding the Church's vain protestations continue to attempt to pry our understanding of the world out of the Dark Ages.

All religion can do these days, apparently, is promise life everlasting. Interestingly, this can be neither proven nor dis-proven, but given religion's track record elsewhere, I know which way I lean. But yet I remain open to change my ideas as new evidence is presented and explored. This is something religion has historically fought at every step.

So atheism, is not, and never will be a religion, for we do not need to punish, cajole and threaten others into adopting our lack of belief in the unbelievable. The thousands and thousands of gods man has invented for himself have come and gone through the ages. It's time we put them to rest for all of our good.

[Frog]

Yeah, these are Christian extremists.. Just like their Muslim opposites (the extremists ones), they are the same, just on the other end of the spectrum..

They are against teaching evolution, but instead want to teach creationism. They would probably not be opposed to mandatory prayer in school, and they would love to call this country:The christian United states of America. Just like Iran, under non-secular leadership, calls itself: Islamic Republic of Iran.

The founding fathers did want the separation of church and state.