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    Originally posted by phillipj View Post
    De Tocqueville specifically cites examples like the quieting, the murder, of antiwar journalists and the intimidation of blacks on election day.
    Would love to see how Trump has done of any of that...

    Comment


      Does it really matter what the founding fathers had in mind for voting? Ultimately you guys have amended your voting rights a dozen times, not just for women and minorities. All white men weren't allowed to vote until the 1820's. Some states even had religious restrictions to voting. Under the founders only 10-15% of the population could vote. I feel the only reason people use the founders is cause they think they'll be in that 10-15%.

      You have to remember that when the founders were laying this stuff out, most of the population was illiterate. So of course they were fearful of the masses, they understood that an uneducated populace could be bought off, fall victim to mob mentality, or fall for the promises of a charismatic despot.

      Today however, you have no excuse for an uneducated populace. Your people are dumb cause your shitty education system is underfunded. Your to blame for the outcome of your poor decisions.

      My point being, each time it was amended, it was with new understanding and a reflection of the times. Doing it again would be no more catastrophic than any of the previous.

      If you wanna start restricting voting, can't really say your a free country. Where do you draw the line with restrictions? Wealth, education background, race, social status, religious affiliation, gender, sexual preference? Seems pretty anti freedom and rights to me. Someone mentioned a civics exam, hate to break it to you but only 1 out of 4 americans can pass the citizenship exam. Which is a civics exam. Doesn't bode well.

      You also have the problem of screaming about the importance of voting, but you make it harder to vote than any other democratic nation on earth. Yet you wonder why you have low voter turnout. Maybe start with treating voting with the respect you guys claim to have for it.

      Comment


        Originally posted by myinfernalbmw View Post

        Would love to see how Trump has done of any of that...
        You've severely confused what I said!
        1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

        Comment


          Originally posted by CarpHunter View Post
          Does it really matter what the founding fathers had in mind for voting? Ultimately you guys have amended your voting rights a dozen times, not just for women and minorities. All white men weren't allowed to vote until the 1820's. Some states even had religious restrictions to voting. Under the founders only 10-15% of the population could vote. I feel the only reason people use the founders is cause they think they'll be in that 10-15%.

          You have to remember that when the founders were laying this stuff out, most of the population was illiterate. So of course they were fearful of the masses, they understood that an uneducated populace could be bought off, fall victim to mob mentality, or fall for the promises of a charismatic despot.

          Today however, you have no excuse for an uneducated populace. Your people are dumb cause your shitty education system is underfunded. Your to blame for the outcome of your poor decisions.

          My point being, each time it was amended, it was with new understanding and a reflection of the times. Doing it again would be no more catastrophic than any of the previous.

          If you wanna start restricting voting, can't really say your a free country. Where do you draw the line with restrictions? Wealth, education background, race, social status, religious affiliation, gender, sexual preference? Seems pretty anti freedom and rights to me. Someone mentioned a civics exam, hate to break it to you but only 1 out of 4 americans can pass the citizenship exam. Which is a civics exam. Doesn't bode well.

          You also have the problem of screaming about the importance of voting, but you make it harder to vote than any other democratic nation on earth. Yet you wonder why you have low voter turnout. Maybe start with treating voting with the respect you guys claim to have for it.
          ^ Tough love, and I applaud all those truths above; condescension won't help the cause much here, though.

          CarpHunter: I'm sure you realize -- you see right through-- the amazing Myth-Making here in America. There's so many wonderful things and people here, as I'm sure you well know, I mean, road-trip this beautiful country and you'll know. And there are many positive and fantastic things the country or some of our most stellar citizens do. But the overwhelming messaging everywhere -- in ads, in our movies, on our news, and especially 99.9% of our politicians -- is that of the American myth of "Exceptionalism". "The shining Beacon on the Hill" ... This is very comforting to Americans and you see people wrap themself in a flag, all teary-eyed getting nostalgic listening to a Reagan / Obama / Trump. But it isn't true.

          A wonderful subject if anyone cares to get into it though.
          1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

          Comment


            With his name & Trump's so much in the news this week it's worth checking out Roger Stone if you don't know him. Also Roy Cohn if you don't know him. Important to know Trump's political mentors, how we got here.
            1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

            Comment


              We got here due to 8 years of Obama, and the country not wanting 4 more of it under Hillary.
              Originally posted by Fusion
              If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
              The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


              The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

              Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
              William Pitt-

              Comment


                Originally posted by CarpHunter View Post
                Someone mentioned a civics exam, hate to break it to you but only 1 out of 4 americans can pass the citizenship exam. Which is a civics exam. Doesn't bode well.

                You also have the problem of screaming about the importance of voting, but you make it harder to vote than any other democratic nation on earth. Yet you wonder why you have low voter turnout. Maybe start with treating voting with the respect you guys claim to have for it.
                1. Assuming your statistics are correct, that means 75% of the population shouldn't be allowed to vote.
                2. What are these difficult restrictions surrounding voting in the US? Many states you don't need an ID, you're given time off work to do so, so what is so hard about voting in America?
                Need parts now? Need them cheap? steve@blunttech.com
                Chief Sales Officer, Midwest DivisionóBlunt Tech Industries

                www.gutenparts.com
                One stop shopping for NEW, USED and EURO PARTS!

                Comment


                  Question as an ignorant foreigner, do you require a voter card that would be sent to an address a voter registered at? Or is it as simple as walking off the street into a polling station and putting your name down?

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by cale View Post
                    Question as an ignorant foreigner, do you require a voter card that would be sent to an address a voter registered at? Or is it as simple as walking off the street into a polling station and putting your name down?
                    Procedures can vary from state to state, and some state procedures have been struck down over time as they were either discriminatory or simply illegal.

                    In Maryland, just outside of Washinton, D.C. you typically register or change party affiliation at the same time as you change your address on your driving license, but you can also do so online, via mail, or in person. Prior to an election you will get an informational booklet, either from your registered political party or your municipality that details candidates, resolutions, and your polling place. You can vote in advance if desired by requesting an absentee ballot, or on an election day you go to the polling center (often a school or some other public building), give your name, address, and potentially another identifying piece of information such as your date of birth and proceed to vote on a ballot that is assigned to you specifically. The ballot is given to the voter in an envelope, you remove it, put it in the electronic voting machine, select your choices, the machine punches or otherwise marks the ballot, the voter then puts the ballot in a sealed box and departs. No ID required for most voters.

                    The exception in Maryland, and likely all states, is that first time voters participating in any election that involves a Federal (non-state/non-local) position must prove their identity with either a photo ID, their social security card, or a state issued number in other cases. They may also be asked for a photo ID or a document with their address on it, such as a utility bill, on election day.

                    Some states also allow same day voter registration at the polls, but this likely involves the same documentation as listed above. In many states those voters may take longer to vote as they won't have an assigned ballot ready at the polling station.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by phillipj View Post
                      With his name & Trump's so much in the news this week it's worth checking out Roger Stone if you don't know him. Also Roy Cohn if you don't know him. Important to know Trump's political mentors, how we got here.
                      Originally posted by mrsleeve View Post
                      We got here due to 8 years of Obama, and the country not wanting 4 more of it under Hillary.
                      With those links to the documentaries on Roger Stone & Roy Cohn I just meant how he's become the political persona he is, not how the country has gotten to the point it's at. It's worth looking into these people for understanding, although they are truly disgusting people.

                      I will sorta agree with you -- certain things about the Obama Presidency, as well as the Clintons, has delivered us to age of Trump. I think the country has been nosediving to here long before that though. We had a great window for real change in 2008 right after the financial collapse and we blew it.
                      Last edited by phillipj; 02-16-2020, 12:36 PM.
                      1990 BMW 325iC Triple Black Hard Top, Self-Wrenched, Original Owner Family

                      Comment


                        I didn't catch the debate, but if the polls are correct, the odds are that folks will vote for someone that isn't Trump. Which means that everyone last night has a potential shot.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by cale View Post
                          Question as an ignorant foreigner, do you require a voter card that would be sent to an address a voter registered at? Or is it as simple as walking off the street into a polling station and putting your name down?
                          As already said, it varies state to state. You would think that verifying your identity when voting would be the most basic common sense procedure, yet that isn't the case. In my state, you only have to give them your name and verify your address and they hand you a ballot. The state republicans have tried several times to pass voter ID laws requiring you to show a photo ID when voting, but they've been met with cries of racism and voter suppression. Apparently it can cause a financial burden to minorities and the elderly to require a government issued ID card, even though the laws included provisions for free IDs to those who couldn't afford them. This is one of those issues that I don't understand how you can pretend to be intellectually honest while being against voter ID laws.

                          Originally posted by Javier h View Post
                          I didn't catch the debate, but if the polls are correct, the odds are that folks will vote for someone that isn't Trump. Which means that everyone last night has a potential shot.
                          Your opinion might be different if you watched it. That was a shit covered garbage fire. It certainly was entertaining though.

                          Comment


                            I taped it so maybe on the weekend, I'll get to see it. Bottom-line is that I don't think people will be necessarily voting for who they want. Its more likely casting a vote against the person they don't want to see. I can't imagine another four years of this level of bickering but we'll know in what 9 months? Gut feeling is that someone will be elected that we wouldn't necessarily vote for. Just seems like the perfect storm. We just might be shocked.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Javier h View Post
                              I didn't catch the debate, but if the polls are correct, the odds are that folks will vote for someone that isn't Trump. Which means that everyone last night has a potential shot.
                              Exactly what all the experts said up until the day of the election last time.

                              At this point I think I'd like to see Bloomberg. He's enough of a centrist he's not really going to make it much worse than it is now.
                              Need parts now? Need them cheap? steve@blunttech.com
                              Chief Sales Officer, Midwest DivisionóBlunt Tech Industries

                              www.gutenparts.com
                              One stop shopping for NEW, USED and EURO PARTS!

                              Comment


                                Yes thats just who I want as the CIC of the military, and in charge of things is present your papers, Mr "Stop and Frisk"
                                Originally posted by Fusion
                                If a car is the epitome of freedom, than an electric car is house arrest with your wife titty fucking your next door neighbor.
                                The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. -Alexis de Tocqueville


                                The Desire to Save Humanity is Always a False Front for the Urge to Rule it- H. L. Mencken

                                Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants.
                                William Pitt-

                                Comment

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