N52 Swap Discussion

[hoveringuy]

I signed-up for Alfa Club twilight lapping last night and it was a good event as usual. Had a fresh set of Azeni 660+ tires that were pre-heat cycled and was impressed by them. I got to the event late and only got a few laps in the first session, but enough to scrub-in the tires. Quickly set a PB in my second lap of the second session, and then another PB well into the third session (2nd or 3rd lap is usually my quickest, so it's unusual that I'm fast towards the end of a session, but there was traffic...).

https://youtu.be/yv_rHV1AHTI

Parts of the night felt like a DTM race, running with a Cosworth 190E...

https://youtu.be/nVciQnKhRSs

It's nice that there's not a single drop of fluid under the car in the morning. Just 100% quick and reliable!

adam.nonis Is going to help me dial-up the power just a hair now. Still running the pedestrian DISA intake....

[DesertBMW]

I always wondered on M20 e30s if the oil cooler is something that the engine really need or it is just a sale gimmick. Then on E28/E34 5 series there is no oil cooler on M20 engine and the chassis is much heavier.

[hoveringuy]

Last summer I measured my oil temps after a track session and they were too hot for me, so I added a coolant-to-oil stacked plate heat exchanger that's common to many of the factory N52's. I instantly noticed that the coolant takes much longer to come up to temperature because it needs to warm all the oil along with the coolant, which is good.

I had a ho-hum day at the track yesterday because I spent 90% of my time teaching the Car Control Clinic students and getting vertigo on the skid pad. I did get some lapping in the late afternoon and collected "after" data.

Temps went down from 265 to 245, which is better but still not great. If I did any kind of endurance racing I would definitely want the N54 style oil cooler with a thermostatically controlled radiator. I also noticed that last summer the oil would stay hot basically forever until it naturally cooled, like it was sitting in a thermos bottle. Now the temps come down almost instantly as I leave the track because it's being actively cooled.

temps were taken with a thermocouple down the dip tube, sitting in the middle of the pan.

[ethirty-eric]

I agree with this. You really need to read through this whole thread, probably multiple times during the process. Nando talked a bunch about how MSV70 uses E46 protocols, I think he even said the cluster from one would just work. A couple of us have used 22RPD for the ECU work, they've been good so far.

Thanks, I've started to plan going down this route. EKP from the Z4 is on it's way.

I did N55 swap into E36 so the whole procedure will be very similar, you can watch my whole instructional video on youtube. Then what is the point of having N52 in E46? It will not feel any better than having stock 2005 M54B30 330i 6 speed that you could buy for cheap then again it is just slow car anyway. With E46 you have to have 500hp engine to have any fun with it, that is why I am asking what is the point.

Well, it wasn't planned. I fell into a good deal for a prefacelift coupe, which is the platform I wanted. Around here, e46 coupes are harder to find than sedans or verts. Then, an opportunity for the N52 came around. So, I figured why not put them together. I'm an old fart and high horsepower cars isn't my thing and I'll just get into trouble with them anyway. I want a nice drivers car. The N52 is what I've read as the last good NA six banger. Also, tuning it will get more HP than an M54. Not a huge delta, but enough to make it fun (for me anyway). Also, it will be somewhat unique. Putting a stock motor in the stock chassis - boring. I don't want the complexity of a turbo. I was happy with my slightly massaged ZHP sedan. That's my goal and then a bit more. I love the challenge of just piecing it all together. I'm an engineer by trade and by heart. Is 300hp achievable or close to it? In roughly a 3000 lb car, it will be more entertaining than stock. I don't need double the horsepower. Anyway, I'll check out the video and see if it will help me out.

[DesertBMW]

Ok, thanks! It looks like I can start with an EWS delete. Where can I get this done? I've seen BimmerTools does it. I already purchased their MSV80 QuickFlash. Does anyone here on the forum also provide this service? Looking at other options. Before spending more money heading down MSV80, is the MSV70 a better route? Or if I EWS delete my MSV80, is it basically working the same as MSV70 EWS delete?

I did N55 swap into E36 so the whole procedure will be very similar, you can watch my whole instructional video on youtube. Then what is the point of having N52 in E46? It will not feel any better than having stock 2005 M54B30 330i 6 speed that you could buy for cheap then again it is just slow car anyway. With E46 you have to have 500hp engine to have any fun with it, that is why I am asking what is the point.

[Striker01]

I'm no expert, but from what I've seen, you'll want to use MSV70.


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I agree with this. You really need to read through this whole thread, probably multiple times during the process. Nando talked a bunch about how MSV70 uses E46 protocols, I think he even said the cluster from one would just work. A couple of us have used 22RPD for the ECU work, they've been good so far.

[adam.nonis]

I'm no expert, but from what I've seen, you'll want to use MSV70.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[ethirty-eric]

Ok, thanks! It looks like I can start with an EWS delete. Where can I get this done? I've seen BimmerTools does it. I already purchased their MSV80 QuickFlash. Does anyone here on the forum also provide this service? Looking at other options. Before spending more money heading down MSV80, is the MSV70 a better route? Or if I EWS delete my MSV80, is it basically working the same as MSV70 EWS delete?

[Caperix]

In theory the e46 should be an easy swap using z4 parts. There seems to be more info on ews delete for msv70 as it can have a programming header added as nando found early in these conversions. E83's use msv80.1 so it is likely possible to use that dme as well, just not as much information is out there on it. You will need to have the dme reflashed to e85/6 z4 or e83 x3 to have the correct can protocol. The ekps will need to match as well, there are msv80 cars that use a fuel pump relay but they use cas & ptcan so i don't believe that has been figured out yet.
I am interested to hear how your swap goes as I have been thinking of picking up an e46 compact & doing a n52 swap

[ethirty-eric]

Thanks, that helps! The part numbers especially to make sure of what I have or what I should have. I grabbed an accelerator out of a later E46. Will this work in place of the E90 pedal or does the pedal have to match the throttle body?

[projectJTv4]

By no means complete, but this may be helpful:

https://www.r3vlimited.com/board/forum/e30-technical-forums/24v-engine-swaps/n54-n52-swap-forum/10079212-i’m-joining-the-club?p=10079214#post10079214

[ethirty-eric]

This is my first post. I'm pretty new here and I was shopping for an E30. I recently ended up getting an E46 chassis. I'm really interested in this particular thread because I plan to swap in an N52. I have a partial motor, partial harness and some modules. Apart from reading thru 55 pages to get the information I need, is there a summary of all the electronic parts needed to get the motor to start and run? This is what I have so far:

1. engine harness with small DME connector [x60002, x60003], it's missing x60001 and harness, which connects the CAS, EKP, accelerator pedal, etc.
2. engine harness with large DME connector [x60004, x60005, x60006, x60007]
3. matching MSV80, CAS and key.
4. throttle body for both n52 and n52n. I got the later TB because I want to go with MSV80, assuming it's a better DME. But now I'm reading that the MSV70 is easier. I can just buy another DME if this is the preferred DME.
5. N52 long block with injectors, coil packs, 3 stage intake and most of the sensors. Missing the valvetronic motor and accessories [alternator, electric water pump, power steering pump, tensioner pulleys]. Oh, also the O2 sensors.

From reading some of this thread, I will need the EKP fuel pump module and the IVM integrated fuse block. The main question is, can someone summarize the needed parts? I believe some of the modules can be deleted by coding or re-flashing the DME. My background is reverse engineering and I do a lot of this CAN protocol work. I hope I can add to this knowledge base and help create things that are needed to help the cause. Sorry, I'm not an E30 owner but I am an N52/E46 owner now. I'm looking for help on the N52 side of things.

[hoveringuy]

I've been trying to do a proper corner weight of my car for a while now, all I've known is that I cross the big scales at 2700# and that my car is around 2470#

Short of proper corner scales, I bought a $50 Amazon 700# scale and leveled the car. I rolled it back and forth each time I moved the scale to unbind the suspension, measuring 1 wheel at a time. (the other 3 wheels were on lumber to match the scale height)

N52 (obviously), no A/C, no sunroof, 2 Sparco seats, no radio or speakers. no tar. rear seat delete.

Full carpet, full tank of gas, spare.

Power steering moved to trunk, 38# lead battery replaced by 6# lithium.

If I remove the spare my full-up track weight is 2400 with a full tank.

Update to my previous weight; I borrowed a set of proper corner scales and the total was shockingly close to what I got just using a single 700# Amazon scale switched from wheel to wheel to wheel...

-no sunroof
-full tank of gas
-no spare, Sparco seats, lithium battery.

Goal is under 2400 with full fuel. That's means carbon hood and lighter bumpers.

[hoveringuy]

My mini-depot overhaul is complete. I'm pleased with the utility of the new reservoir, the level sender works great! I need to add a flow restrictor to the bleed line because the 3/8" line flows WAY too much (but it is effective)

Coolant temperature seems to take longer to come up to temperature, it's freezing outside presently, so that's a lot of the reason, but I also wonder if it's because the oil is now being heated by the coolant....?

I had a small weep from the (original!) coolant pipe O-ring, as well as small oil weeps from the also-original VANOS and cam sensor O-rings. Everything else looked fine.

Also a picture with the two styles of coolant pipe, with and without oil heat exchanger bleed nipple.

[hoveringuy]

moatilliattaAlso, the baffle isn't there primarily to be a baffle

That's just a bonus.

It's a structural element because I have large, flat sides and 10psi really adds-up!