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What are my options - State Referee modified exhaust ticket

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    #31
    I know this sounds too simple so it must be stupid, but, what if you transfer your dash with your VIN to another bronzit (stock that passes smog), put your plates on it.... get it checked... it passes and then you're good to go. I mean do they check the chassis VINs? Probably not.
    Yeah so nevermind swapping a drivetrain. Just swap the numerical identification components!

    Currently building a badass coffee table
    Random stuff on insta @kevanromero

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      #32
      I bet they look at the obvious cowl VIN while the do a visual on the engine.

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        #33
        Originally posted by bmwman91 View Post
        I'd have never thought that the V8 in those things could sound bad, but apparently lots of guys found a way to pay money to get there.


        Even in the bay, I think it really depends on where you are (how white your neighborhood is). My neighbor has a 1jzgte that just had a dump pipe on it. He drove it like that through Oakland for months without problem. But he warned me to be careful driving any modified car through Walnut Creek or Concord.

        Sounds like OP was on a known driving road, so the cop was there just to hand out tickets. Kinda like if CHP sat on 35 all day.
        sigpic
        1987 - 325i Convertible Delphin Auto [SOLD], 325i Convertible Delphin Manual [SOLD]
        1989 - 325i Convertible Bronzit m30b35 swapped [SCRAPPED], 325i Sedan Alpine Auto[DD]
        1991 - 325i Coupe Laguna Manual [Project], 535i Sedan Alpine [SCRAPPED]

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          #34
          Originally posted by bmwman91 View Post
          So is this a SoCal thing with cops going extra hard on modded cars? Up in the Bay Area I can't say I have heard of a case like this in more than a decade. Hell, I wish they WOULD get a little more aggressive about some stuff. New AMG's with (obviously) straight pipes rolling around at all hours, stuff like that. I'd have never thought that the V8 in those things could sound bad, but apparently lots of guys found a way to pay money to get there.

          Anyway, I like the diesel "village bicycle" idea. LEGIT.
          I don't know if it's a socal thing, if it's specifically a malibu canyon thing (most likely - people really go too wild there treating it like a personal racetrack), if the cop was just a power hungry dick, or if it was his creative way of expressing appreciation for my car...

          but you're right, there are droves of people far worse than I so idk... just got unlucky I guess
          '89 325i OBD2 S52 BUILD THREAD
          Shadetree30

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            #35
            Originally posted by Chilezen View Post
            I know this sounds too simple so it must be stupid, but, what if you transfer your dash with your VIN to another bronzit (stock that passes smog), put your plates on it.... get it checked... it passes and then you're good to go. I mean do they check the chassis VINs? Probably not.
            Yeah so nevermind swapping a drivetrain. Just swap the numerical identification components!
            Originally posted by roguetoaster View Post
            I bet they look at the obvious cowl VIN while the do a visual on the engine.
            Yea there are a few more obvious VIN locations they could check, though this idea crossed my mind too.

            Originally posted by McGyver View Post

            Even in the bay, I think it really depends on where you are (how white your neighborhood is). My neighbor has a 1jzgte that just had a dump pipe on it. He drove it like that through Oakland for months without problem. But he warned me to be careful driving any modified car through Walnut Creek or Concord.

            Sounds like OP was on a known driving road, so the cop was there just to hand out tickets. Kinda like if CHP sat on 35 all day.
            This is correct. There's been a pretty concerted effort generally cracking down on motorcycles/reckless driving in those areas. The famous mulholland highway "snake" was first patrolled heavily, and now closed. Cars/motorcycles literally were parking in a parking lot area and taking turns ripping that section up and down. It was dangerous. Seems like they're starting to do the same int he other popular canyons. And I kinda knew better than to be driving around there later in the morning, hence why I was just cruising... and then I got nailed for nothing anyway...

            I'll just locate some other canyons a bit further off the beaten path. And do more autox and track days!
            '89 325i OBD2 S52 BUILD THREAD
            Shadetree30

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              #36
              Originally posted by Chilezen View Post
              I know this sounds too simple so it must be stupid, but, what if you transfer your dash with your VIN to another bronzit (stock that passes smog), put your plates on it.... get it checked... it passes and then you're good to go. I mean do they check the chassis VINs? Probably not.
              Yeah so nevermind swapping a drivetrain. Just swap the numerical identification components!
              That's a very risky idea.

              I had a friend who bought an e12 that was swapped and BAR'd as an m30b34 swap (somehow BAR missed the piano top pistons). He went to register it and they checked the VIN on the dash, cowl, and a door. Apparently a door had been replaced at one point and didn't match. He ended up having to take it to a referee to get the VIN verified, it was a huge hassle.

              Honestly OP, why not just make the car legal, get your BAR sticker, and never worry again?
              sigpic
              1987 - 325i Convertible Delphin Auto [SOLD], 325i Convertible Delphin Manual [SOLD]
              1989 - 325i Convertible Bronzit m30b35 swapped [SCRAPPED], 325i Sedan Alpine Auto[DD]
              1991 - 325i Coupe Laguna Manual [Project], 535i Sedan Alpine [SCRAPPED]

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                #37
                Originally posted by Sh3rpak!ng View Post

                Evap system? Charcoal canister? crankcase air/oil separator? Fresh ECU with EWS coded out (since mine has all readiness monitors set to green)? I still also have a CEL from the swap I never figured out :P and I'd need a new harness since I got rid of all the wires in mine that weren't needed for the emissions stuff I no longer have, and then I'd need to adapt the wiring harness again to plug into the e30 chassis....

                Would I not need to get it BAR legal first then do the referee inspection? Since technically even if it was BAR compliant, it'd still be an illegitimate swap?


                The ECU with readiness monitors all set to pass is actually something I've been very curious about... would that get flagged in a smog check? Because if not I could just fake wire up all those things to pass visual
                I have never actually heard of them checking this - but at some point California required the manufacturers to publish the checksum for each calibration. So if the DME is modified at all (even if you didn't change any emissions settings), they would know by reading the checksum and comparing it to a database. I don't know what engine swap you have - but I don't think this existed on the M52/S52, but it definitely exists on the M54 and newer DMEs.

                Funny thing is it's actually possible to write an algorithm that pads the calibration to give you a checksum that matches the original... we considered doing this, but again, I've never actually heard of this being checked.

                I just checked, M52s and S52s don't have it (it's CARB_MODE_9_CVN in the daten files, which is really just the checksum). Doesn't look like that started until MS43/MSS54.
                Last edited by nando; 09-04-2020, 09:14 AM.
                Build thread

                Bimmerlabs

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                  #38
                  Originally posted by McGyver View Post

                  That's a very risky idea.

                  I had a friend who bought an e12 that was swapped and BAR'd as an m30b34 swap (somehow BAR missed the piano top pistons). He went to register it and they checked the VIN on the dash, cowl, and a door. Apparently a door had been replaced at one point and didn't match. He ended up having to take it to a referee to get the VIN verified, it was a huge hassle.

                  Honestly OP, why not just make the car legal, get your BAR sticker, and never worry again?
                  Evap system, Charcoal canister, crankcase air/oil separator, Fresh ECU with EWS coded out (since mine has all readiness monitors set to green)? I still also have a CEL from the swap I never figured out :P and I'd need a new harness since I got rid of all the wires in mine that weren't needed for the emissions stuff I no longer have, and then I'd need to adapt the wiring harness again to plug into the e30 chassis, full exhaust fabbed, OE air intake.

                  This is still a considerable amount of work and cost, both hunting all these parts down, reversing all the existing work i've carefully done, and installing all the BAR stuff. I honestly do not have the energy or motivation to do any of it. My free time is pretty minimal. I just want to drive.

                  Now if there was some way to KNOW the ECU readiness monitors wouldn't give me trouble, this would make most of these items much easier. I'd just fake wire and plumb most of it.... but still a decent amount of work. idk.

                  Edit: would I have to put an M52 intake manifold back on?

                  Originally posted by nando View Post

                  I have never actually heard of them checking this - but at some point California required the manufacturers to publish the checksum for each calibration. So if the DME is modified at all (even if you didn't change any emissions settings), they would know by reading the checksum and comparing it to a database. I don't know what engine swap you have - but I don't think this existed on the M52/S52, but it definitely exists on the M54 and newer DMEs.

                  Funny thing is it's actually possible to write an algorithm that pads the calibration to give you a checksum that matches the original... we considered doing this, but again, I've never actually heard of this being checked.
                  it is an S52 and OBD2

                  Is there any way to verify your thoughts here? If so it would change the balance of the decision towards attempting to BAR it pretty significantly
                  '89 325i OBD2 S52 BUILD THREAD
                  Shadetree30

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                    #39
                    They will check everything, including engine ID, VIN's, Evap, etc. Yes, you will also need the correct intake manifold depending on how picky the ref is. I suggest doing what you can to get it compliant before the check as you can knock out 2 birds with 1 stone. If you come up short, they will let you know what needs to be addressed to get it certified. You can thank the Honda swap game for all this. Swaps created a black market for JDM and stolen engines back in the day so they started popping hoods and checking engine ID's.
                    "I'd probably take the E30 M3 in this case just because I love that little car, and how tanky that inline 6 is." - thecj

                    85 323i M TECH 1 S52 - ALPINEWEISS/SCHWARZE
                    88 M3 - LACHSSILBER/SCHWARZE
                    89 M3 - ALPINEWEISS II/M TECH CLOTH-ALCANTARA
                    91 M TECHNIC CABRIO TURBO - MACAOBLAU/M TECH CLOTH-LEATHER

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                      #40
                      How do they verify if your Evap is actually working? Pre 95 cars only get visual and dyno/sniff right? Or would a post 95 vin on your motor make them require a obd2 scan?
                      91' 318is 90' 325is

                      Originally posted by Sonny
                      Buy the E30s, they ain't gonna last long
                      E30 can make you, E30 can break you
                      "He who controls the Nova's, controls the Boomers"

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                        #41
                        I'm not in CA, but I think engine swaps there have to retain the appropriate emissions of whatever equipment is installed in the car. and in the stock location to be legal there. Technically the first part is required everywhere, you know, the whole tampering with mandated emissions equipment thing.

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                          #42
                          How does cali DMV work with smog if the vehicle is sold out of state and then brought back in? I know cali transfers back fees to the vehicle if it is sold out of state and titled back in state, regardless of who the owner was back fees still need paid.

                          Can you "sell" the car out of state to a family member or friend and then "sell" it back to yourself down the road? I don't have emissions where I'm at in AZ and I've had a few cars from phoenix that required smog testing- titled them in my home town in South dakota which has no smog through the whole state and then transferred them back down to AZ. AZ smog is lame regardless so it's way easier to fool than CA in the first place.

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                            #43
                            Originally posted by tyeler18 View Post
                            How does cali DMV work with smog if the vehicle is sold out of state and then brought back in? I know cali transfers back fees to the vehicle if it is sold out of state and titled back in state, regardless of who the owner was back fees still need paid. Can you "sell" the car out of state to a family member or friend and then "sell" it back to yourself down the road? I don't have emissions where I'm at in AZ and I've had a few cars from phoenix that required smog testing- titled them in my home town in South dakota which has no smog through the whole state and then transferred them back down to AZ. AZ smog is lame regardless so it's way easier to fool than CA in the first place.
                            So when you bring a car into ca you need to get the car inspected at the dmv. So you won’t be able to title the car in ca at that point. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                              #44
                              This may sound like a long shot but you might as well go with the "plead not guilty and pray that the officer doesn't show up" route. This tactic usually works 50% of the time for me. Worst case scenario is that you'll still have to State Ref/part out/sell your car and pay the ticket.

                              Step one: Wait till the last day of the day to set an extension online for your ticket.

                              Step two: Wait to the last day of your extension to set an arraignment.

                              Step three: Show up to your arraignment and plead not guilty. Ask for the furthest date possible.

                              This process can possibly take at least 6 months or even longer with the Rona in place

                              Step four: Pray to the E30 gods that the officer doesnt show up.

                              or

                              Either plead not guilty and fight your ticket, explain to the judge that you fixed front plate and exhaust, also how the officer cited you for a loud exhaust ticket even though you were stopped. (Possibly a good idea to do both fixed and have an officer sign off on them)

                              or ask the Judge if he can reduce the exhaust ticket to a correctable offense and you'll plead guilty. Explain that the car is not running or something and its difficult to State Ref the car

                              At this point it'll depends on the Judge and how they feel that day.

                              Oh, and as long as you keep that ticket with you and show it to the next officer that pulls you over, I think you should be okay to drive the car.


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                                #45
                                Non-correctable is exactly what it says. It is set as an easy money grab for police, to create revenue.
                                Again the part that is gonna bone you, is the state ref. Read so many dudes just parting their cars out to not deal with the nonsense. Make an appointment with the BAR guy at Pierce college, he's an easy guy to talk to and will guide you in the right direction.
                                @IRON-E30 aka Edwin:D

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