24V AWD Swap Knowledge Base

[Nisse Järnet]

525ix E34 with a frankenpan S85 engine :D

[Bimmer_man]

So i have a few question on the 24v swap. Ive been trying to figure out the 24v swap for a while read through this a bit im sure I missed a few things. If anyone can answer these questions for me please do.

As far as the drivline is concerned i was looking into the e34 set up and the car itself was never imported to the usa thus making those parts stupid expensive in shipping. So as an alternative i got in contact with Nisse to see if the e46 xi drivline will work and it looks like it will. I still however have a few questions regarding the M54/S54 in the ix.

I was thinking on using the E46 xi oil pan with the engine utilizing the e30 steering rack and subframe. Dose anyone know or tried this to see if it works if not Nisse did say i could use the E46 xi front subframe with some modification. If i went that rout i could use the e46 steering rack as well and that would be cool. Im just wanting to gather some more information on what im looking into.

Im sure that the oil pump tube may need modification. Im still reading into this some please forgive if some of the info is wrong.

I swear these ix cars is a larger love hate relationship than any other e30 haha.

[nomansland92]

So far I e46 rack hasn't been used to my knowledge, the tie rods will not fit into the hubs. With some machine work I would imagine it's easily possible though.

[Bimmer_man]

yeah the hubs have to be machined to make them work but would be a little bit of a nicer feel thats for sure.

[nomansland92]

I looked into using that rack with my e34 setup but I was worried about adding bump steer. My car already seems to have a fair amount at my ride hight, Just another project on the to do list.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-T817A using Tapatalk

[stonea]

Theres a few problems with the e46 xi stuff. First off the front subframe is very big and very heavy. Also its very far from bolt on. I've seen someone do a AWD e36 ti where they used a e46 subframe and it took a lot of work. Will is trying to design a custom front subframe that would either fix all of the clearance/bump steer problems, or at least make them much better. He's also designing it around the E53 x5 oil pan which would be perfect for you since you mentioned the M54. The e46 oil pan won't work with the current front subframe. I forget why but I know it was mentioned in here at some point in all 800 something posts. The e46 AWD system also uses an open transfer case. Not necessarily the end of the world, but in my opinion if your putting all of this time and money into this swap it should be as close as perfect as it can be. I talked to Tyler over at Arc Asylum about producing some subframes, but at the time (maybe a year ago?) he said he was to busy to take on that project.

Nando still has some of his e34 ix stuff thats he's trying to get rid of if you really wanna go that route. Technically so far thats the only proven way to do it except for a fraken or custom oil pan. But again thats far from bolt on.

[nomansland92]

I have all Nando e34 parts now. Going to use them under my boosted m20, well at least in going to try

[nando]

The easiest way to use the E34 stuff is to do what nisse did, and push the engine back into the firewall an inch or so. I did consider this but realistically, I don't have the time or equipment to do that correctly. Other ways would be to use a different subframe or make a custom one.

as far as the E46 rack goes, the tie rods are fairly simple. You'll need the strut housings machined to fit the larger E45 ball joints, and I think you'll have to shorten the tie rods a little bit, but basically they are the right length already for the E30. I know John at WOTtech said he could do them for me no problem. I'm still considering the E46 rack, but I'd probably end up modifying my subframe to make it bolt up. The linkage will require an extra U joint, but not that big of a deal really. It also gives more room for a front diff.

Ultimately the reason I decided to change my mind, again, and go a different route - yes, the E30 parts aren't the strongest. But as far as AWD goes, it's a pretty light package. All of the other BMW systems are heavier. I decided in the end, I'd prefer a tight, balanced set up with minimal weight over big power.

swapping the entire subframe from an E46 is a worthy idea of consideration. That would give plenty of room to use the E34 pan/diff without pushing everything back, and you get the better steering rack. But again, it will weigh more - not a big deal if you're going turbo or S54 though.

IIRC you want the 2003+ E46 racks. earlier ones weren't great. I measured the # of turns lock to lock, and the E46 xi rack is significantly quicker than the E30 ix. it would be a fun setup if somebody got it to work.

[Bimmer_man]

nomansland92 if you dont wind up using the e34 stuff let me know i will be happy to use them haha.

As far as the e46 stuff. i know the diffs where open but from what i was reading on e46fenatics the tc itself is not an open system. the Diffs are open but the tc is another story i think. Im not saying youre wrong just hearing conflicting info i suppose.

[Nisse Järnet]

Fitting the E46 (or E34) front subframe isn't that big of I deal actually. Sure its alot of work but its totally doable.
The E36ti ix guy is a friend of mine BTW :)
But it sure is heavier as Nando states.

My ix is lighter now than with the stock setup BTW :)

And as I said, the E46 tc is totally open.

[nando]

Yeah, E46 system sucks IMO. The tc is open, only ABS controls slip.

[Bimmer_man]

Wait, so the transfer case slip is controlled by the a s unit in the e46? So dose that mean I'd have to upgrade the abs unit to even utilize the transfer case in the first place?

So I guess my next question is how much dose a e34 drive train cost now? All I've seen is I have to import the parts and that costs stupid money from what I've seen. I may get a passport and drive to Canada lol would be cheaper.

[The Dark Side of Will]

To use either the E34 or E53 Front Drive Assembly (FDA), the swapper will either need to cut into the firewall as Nisse did *OR* build a new front crossmember and more the steering rack forward about 1.25", as I should be able to do by the end of the year.

IOW, the front of the sump on both E34 and E53 pans is so far forward that it will interfere with the crossmember and steering rack when the bellhousing is located in the original location.

The E46 axle and diff, and the front of the sump as a result, are at least THREE INCHES FURTHER FORWARD than the corresponding features on the E34 and E53 FDA's.

That means that if you use the E46 FDA, you'll either have to move the engine 3 to 4 inches into the firewall or... well that's really it. If you don't carve up the firewall, you'll have to locate the rack so far forward that you'll never get sensible steering geometry.

[Bimmer_man]

Okay so as it sits the e34 set up is the over all best way to do it there really isn't any two ways about it it seems like on the ix.

So I'll have to do one of three things

Find a seller in the usa ship them to me
Go find them in the north American continent and make a road trip
Or pay an international seller to ship them to me

What are the prices for the e34 stuff then. Just a rough estimate. If anyone knows that.

[stonea]

I wouldn't say its the best route. Like Will said, he should get the cross member design done by the end of the year. I would suggest using the getrag 260 with stock transfer case. Custom front driveshaft with a u joint. Will's cross member, and use the e53 X5 oil pan, engine arms, and 3.64 diff ratio. All of that paired with the M54 will make a great little AWD toy. Thats the route I might go, but I'm thinking about doing a M30 with a turbo from the M106 in the ix and drop my M54 into a 325i I'm picking up. I'm trying to make the 325i as light as possible and fun to drive in the mountains, so the aluminum M54 will help a lot.