Mass Shooting - Umpqua Community College

[Exodus_2pt0]

God go away nutjobs. This is insulting.

Ironic statement.

[ahrensNW]

Did you even read that article? It is so inconclusive in and of itself, all you could say is that no one knows the impact of CCW on the crime rate. More over, its an obvious conclusion that mass shootings happen where guns are banned. Mass shooters typically don't waltz into police stations and engage a known armed populace.

On the one study the article hinges on, it is easy to conclude that CCW's don't increase crime either.

At the very best, using logic, you can say CCWs have no impact on crime rates according to THIS study.

I advocate open carry btw as opposed to CCWs. CCW's don't let any potential criminal know that someone is armed, hence Concealed Carry Weapon.

Your last statement is a good one. Concealed carry weapons don't deter crime. They may be able to stop a criminal once he has already committed a heinous crime, but they don't deter him from committing it. One of the main arguments on here has been "criminals won't commit crime in places where they know people are carrying". How tf are they supposed to know if someone is carrying if you're actually doing a good job of concealed carry. It's pretty fucking sad to see that it's a norm to just except these mass shootings and do nothing to change the way our society excepts them. How much has changed after Sandy Hook, honestly?

BTW if anyone is interested... I own an AR-15 (S&W M&P), a few rifles, I have access to pistols (I'm only 18), and I hunt archery. Saying that I'm an antigun nut is pretty out of place. I'm a member of SCI and the NRA as well.

[Wschnitz]

When does this get moved to politics and religion because its another gun argument.

[marshallnoise]

Your last statement is a good one. Concealed carry weapons don't deter crime. They may be able to stop a criminal once he has already committed a heinous crime, but they don't deter him from committing it. One of the main arguments on here has been "criminals won't commit crime in places where they know people are carrying". How tf are they supposed to know if someone is carrying if you're actually doing a good job of concealed carry. It's pretty fucking sad to see that it's a norm to just except these mass shootings and do nothing to change the way our society excepts them. How much has changed after Sandy Hook, honestly?

BTW if anyone is interested... I own an AR-15 (S&W M&P), a few rifles, I have access to pistols (I'm only 18), and I hunt archery. Saying that I'm an antigun nut is pretty out of place. I'm a member of SCI and the NRA as well.

We should not accept mass shootings at all. I don't think people generally do accept them. However, when people blame the guns and suggest banning access to them as if that is what will solve the problem, they are missing the real problem. A psycho is still a psycho whether there is a gun in their hand or not.

While we deal with psychos and how to handle them, we don't need to "pass common sense gun laws" that are inevitably used to take guns from law-abiding citizens in the name of the "greater good." These situations are always turned into a power grab which does two things; 1st, it distracts us from dealing with the psychos and 2nd, it rips rights away while simultaneously puts more power into the hands of the government.

Wschnitz, stop clicking on this thread then. Choice is always yours.

[e30rik]

I feel like people only do this shit because they know the media will talk about them for 2 weeks straight. Guns are not the issue, fucking psychopaths are the issue. If they didn't have guns I'm sure they would find another way.

[marshallnoise]

I feel like people only do this shit because they know the media will talk about them for 2 weeks straight. Guns are not the issue, fucking psychopaths are the issue. If they didn't have guns I'm sure they would find another way.

It would be a homicide or two by knife, car, baseball bat, etc. So really, people only know about this nationally because a gun was used and more than 2 people were killed, and it didn't happen in NYC, Chicago or LA. Talk about getting used to something...

[rturbo 930]

IMO if someone is set on killing people, they're gonna find a way to do it. Guns just happen to be the easiest way to do it. I don't like guns, and don't own any guns, but I don't think taking guns away is the answer, and I wouldn't support any movement to do that. Gun regulation that allows responsible owners access to guns, but not psychopaths would be good step in the right direction... but tough to do. The thing is, some people are nuts, and it's very obvious, or at least noticeable. Other people with mental issues are able to hide them extremely well, so even a background check probably wouldn't help.

Tough issue for sure. I do think that more focus on mental illness, and a change of attitude towards mental illness would be a good place to start. It would also help if the media would stop giving these people so much attention.

[kronus]

When does this get moved to politics and religion because its another gun argument.

done

Wschnitz, stop clicking on this thread then. Choice is always yours.

no

[marshallnoise]

no

:p

[Dj Buttchug]

What a total piece of shit.

[Mr. Burns]

and in predictable media fashion, they select the picture of the dude looking sinister with a shaved head holding a riffle.

[CorvallisBMW]

We should not accept mass shootings at all. I don't think people generally do accept them. However, when people blame the guns and suggest banning access to them as if that is what will solve the problem, they are missing the real problem. A psycho is still a psycho whether there is a gun in their hand or not.

Yes, but a "psycho" with a roll of toilet paper can't go shoot up a school.. a "psycho" with a gun can.

We don't have a monopoly on mental illness in this country. What we do have a monopoly on is giving them guns.

While we deal with psychos and how to handle them, we don't need to "pass common sense gun laws" that are inevitably used to take guns from law-abiding citizens in the name of the "greater good." These situations are always turned into a power grab which does two things; 1st, it distracts us from dealing with the psychos and 2nd, it rips rights away while simultaneously puts more power into the hands of the government.

Please explain to me how something like background checks (or training classes, or waiting periods, or licencing, or safe storage, or...) would "take guns from law-abiding citizens".

[marshallnoise]

Yes, but a "psycho" with a roll of toilet paper can't go shoot up a school.. a "psycho" with a gun can.

We don't have a monopoly on mental illness in this country. What we do have a monopoly on is giving them guns.

Hyperbole.

Please explain to me how something like background checks (or training classes, or waiting periods, or licencing, or safe storage, or...) would "take guns from law-abiding citizens".

We have all those.

Oh and 2nd Amendment is there to ensure the government is afraid of it's citizenry. Licensing is a no-no.

I am a gun owner and I don't go around advertising that fact to people in my neighborhood. 1, because its private and none of anyone's damn business and 2, because my house would be an immediate target for criminals to get guns, illegally. Burdensome restrictions effectively "take guns from law-abiding citizens" before they even go out and get one.

[varg]

There are many factors, but thanks in part to the 24 hour news cycle, and in part to staggeringly awful access to mental health care and stigmatization of those who seek it, those very few individuals who are seriously considering this kind of course of action are in effect pushed down this path. Those mentally ill individuals who are predisposed to violence, and are in a special set of circumstances that makes a mass shooting something they consider, are suffering constantly in their heads, and see that they can quickly become household names, infamous, sharing their pain with the entire world. They're suffering, ignored, feeling isolated and like nobody gives a fuck about them, and they can make people give a fuck. All they have to do is scrape together a few hundred dollars to buy a gun, or steal it, then go to the nearest location where they are guaranteed a large number of victims, and with a few trigger pulls, achieve what they want; world renown, and making millions of other people share their pain. You know how when someone jumps in front of a train or kills themselves in their house it doesn't even make the local papers (if they aren't famous) because they don't want more people to follow suit? Please tell me how it makes sense to sensationalize mass murderers and instill fear and pain in the populace over their deeds. It doesn't, but it makes lots of money.

In response to this latest tragedy, what "solutions" to this will be placed on the table by the do-nothing, party-line-or-whoever-pays-best jack-offs we laughably call our "representatives?"

Mandatory background checks for private purchases or a gun registry. This will do nothing. Those who are afraid of losing their access to guns already avoid mental health care even when they know they need it, because they are afraid that a diagnosis will show up on their background checks and keep them from ever owning a gun again.

Capacity limits. This will do nothing but make it so that who wish to abide by the law carry smaller magazines. The potential school shooter, the political/religious extremist, and the gangbanger already have theirs and they aren't going to turn them in.

Wide-spread gun confiscation. It won't happen, we already know this. It wouldn't help anything anyway because all it would do convince those who respect the law to get rid of their guns, and it would instantly expand the black market and criminalize millions of people who never intended to harm anyone.

Gun free zones. These are already widely in place, and they do nothing but ensure that those good people who do sometimes carry a gun are unarmed out of respect for the law.

That's it, nothing sensible, nothing that would actually help anyone who is on this path, will even be considered or proposed, because it is too hard, and too slow. The only thing that will be on the table over the next few months, the only thing that will make the news, is a push for some new gun control laws.

The problem is cultural and political, and until America is willing to accept that our culture and politics are backwards, illogical and sick, and work together towards change, nothing will change.

How on earth is it that a culture that goes to such great length to tell everyone they are special, and strives to offend nobody through political correctness, still stigmatizes the mentally ill so heavily that they often feel they must avoid treatment and diagnosis to not become a pariah?
How is it that huge swaths of the populace fall for the obvious special interest/lobbyist-centric agendas that politicians tell us are for the best (examples; citizens united, obamacare, ethanol mandate)?
How is it that so many people don't find it absolutely sickening that the 24 hour news cycle makes celebrities of people who have done horrible things?
(That same cycle has lead to ZERO journalistic integrity, too, misinformation is willingly spread to the entire world because whoever airs it first gets the money. "We'll retract it later! Air it NOW!") Sometimes the news reminds me of the movie Nightcrawler.
How is it that some people think nothing should change?
Why is it that nothing will?

[z31maniac]

Oh and 2nd Amendment is there to ensure the government is afraid of it's citizenry.

Oh for fucks sake, would all you damn idiots get off it already?

You really think the gov't is afraid of us now? Hell no. They act (or don't act depending on how you look at it) with impunity and have for decades.

I love this deluded fantasy that guys that own some rifles and handguns, that go to the range a few times per year think, that somehow, they would be able to mass any kind of rebellion against the Armed forces of this country.

*insert dipshit comment about how armed forces members wouldn't turn their guns on American citizens*