The Journey of Linda and Friends - the M20b31 Lives

[AWDBOB]

Oh man... the "thinking about selling" line made me sad. Sell the M3 instead ;)

This machine is turning out incredibly cool

nice job! i'm all for focusing on the e30m3. get to work!!!!

At least put some miles on it before you sell it. You've spoken in this very thread about how you always build cars just to sell them when they're done without enjoying them.

Thanks, gents! I am happy with how it is turning out.

And regarding selling, my achilles heel with cars is the inability to leave things alone. Thanks to mjweimer's m20b25 from his "rolling wreck" iS many pages back I had Linda up and running very well and was enjoying the hell out of it. My unwillingness to leave the car alone resulted in additional two years off the road and an open checkbook when I tore it down to build the stroker m20, which snowballed from a "weekend motor swap" to a huge undertaking. I get sick of the cars when they take too much time/money/energy, despite it being my choice to make those decisions. So I will certainly enjoy Linda after I finish it up, but with the M3 just sitting and everything else going on, it just doesn't seem realistic to keep them both. Nothing is set in stone, though, I was just speculating.

[AWDBOB]

I fouled a set of plugs already. I ran BPR5ES the first go around, put BPR6ES into it this time.

Makes me nervous to drive it to get the exhaust done with it running rich from no 02 sensor. I wouldn't mind if it were a short drive, but he's an hour away.

Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr
Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr

[AWDBOB]

My warehouse happens to be attached to an alternator rebuild shop. I took the eyesore that was the old placeholder alternator and had him refinish it. I got that and the rest of the accessories bolted up/belts tightened. Just waiting on one more A/C hose and my dbilas FlowMaster intake (which finally shipped!) before I can throw everything back together and drop the car off for the exhaust fabrication. I'm pretty sure the compressor I am using is good. If not, I will send one off to Jay Stratton for a rebuild. Will find out once I test the clutch and vacuum test it before putting freon in.

Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr
Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr

[moatilliatta]

What are you doing for exhaust?
Don't forget the wideband bung

Excited to see some numbers!

[AWDBOB]

What are you doing for exhaust?
Don't forget the wideband bung

Excited to see some numbers!

I had offset vbands welded onto the collectors of the long tubes before I put them in the car, and then the mid pipe will be dual 2.25", and will have an x pipe 32" back from the collectors (wideband bung in side of x pipe), then to a Stromung catback.

I was considering adding bullet resonators in the mid pipe, but packaging is tight. But, if I don't add resonators it is going to be loud.

Any suggestions for resonators in the midpipe to calm the ole gal down?

And regarding numbers, I am excited, too. There is a local dynojet that I will rent for numbers, but I still need help tuning the car. A few of my buddies are very competent t00ners, but they don't seem too thrilled about Megasquirt. ForcedFirebird seems like the logical choice here.

[moatilliatta]

Which X pipe did you go with?

I'm not on this mount the X / Y pipe back as far as you can train of thought. But looks like you could put resonator in front of the X pipe which is a bit unconventional .

On the race cars we mount it closer with a smooth reducer out of the Y pipe.

Something with stainless or ceramic packing so it wont burn up. Aero, Borla, Biggest you can fit and offset per bank, Maybe 2.5 high flow cats? I like the rasp

The strumung on my Ti is loud, Is it 2.25?

I think most your noise would be canceled by muffler choice so I would focus there first.

[AWDBOB]

Which X pipe did you go with?

I'm not on this mount the X / Y pipe back as far as you can train of thought. But looks like you could put resonator in front of the X pipe which is a bit unconventional .

On the race cars we mount it closer with a smooth reducer out of the Y pipe.

Something with stainless or ceramic packing so it wont burn up. Aero, Borla, Biggest you can fit and offset per bank, Maybe 2.5 high flow cats? I like the rasp

The strumung on my Ti is loud, Is it 2.25?

I think most your noise would be canceled by muffler choice so I would focus there first.

I just got a cheaper 2.25” stamped stainless x pipe. A nicer x pipe carries an insane cost increase over a stamped one. As long as the pipes cross adequately, which they do, all I’m looking for is scavenging since the m20 doesn’t really even need dual 2.25”, so flow isn’t of much concern.

And yeah, me thinks the Stromung will be loud! It probably drops down to 2” if I had to guess.

The 32” thing comes from Pipemax via Digger for exhaust harmonics. He did some extensive dyno testing and it made a surprisingly large difference when the crossover was in the wrong place, especially with low end torque.

I have used the magnaflow 16535 catback before and loved it, but I am just using what I have and dealing with it, because I am incredibly sick of wasting money changing things up. This thing sounds pretty rowdy, so I think it’ll lend itself to being loud more so than a stock m20 would. If someone wants to buy the stromung for the cost of the magnaflow I’d change it up before I have the exhaust done, but I’m not going to put too much energy into that.

I don’t really want to run cats since I’ll be running VR1, and we have no emissions in Indiana so I don’t really care too much for how little the car will be driven.

[moatilliatta]

Pricey, but bolt on dual 60mm... But proper exhaust work isnt cheap either. I'm sure it would sound proper too with being compliant.
Has the X in the rear also...
https://www.supersprint.com/ww-en/sp...onversion.aspx


I get a small SuperSprint discount if you want to swing that way, But also SS stuff goes on clearance a lot from turner since it doesn't move.

I have to say, their stuff though has fit every time and follow though when a set of headers cracked because of crappy AKG Group N engine mounts on a race car - Poly BS..

[digger]

I just got a cheaper 2.25” stamped stainless x pipe. A nicer x pipe carries an insane cost increase over a stamped one. As long as the pipes cross adequately, which they do, all I’m looking for is scavenging since the m20 doesn’t really even need dual 2.25”, so flow isn’t of much concern.

And yeah, me thinks the Stromung will be loud! It probably drops down to 2” if I had to guess.

The 32” thing comes from Pipemax via Digger for exhaust harmonics. He did some extensive dyno testing and it made a surprisingly large difference when the crossover was in the wrong place, especially with low end torque.

I have used the magnaflow 16535 catback before and loved it, but I am just using what I have and dealing with it, because I am incredibly sick of wasting money changing things up. This thing sounds pretty rowdy, so I think it’ll lend itself to being loud more so than a stock m20 would. If someone wants to buy the stromung for the cost of the magnaflow I’d change it up before I have the exhaust done, but I’m not going to put too much energy into that.

I don’t really want to run cats since I’ll be running VR1, and we have no emissions in Indiana so I don’t really care too much for how little the car will be driven.

my latest incarnation was 64" it makes a decent more right down low 1750-2500rpm above that its the same

just find a low height dual in and out muffler for a resonator thats compact but got some volumer to it, this works much better than a pair of 4" OD hot dogs. i ended up getting one made eliminated drone very well,

[AWDBOB]

Pricey, but bolt on dual 60mm... But proper exhaust work isnt cheap either. I'm sure it would sound proper too with being compliant.
Has the X in the rear also...
https://www.supersprint.com/ww-en/sp...onversion.aspx


I get a small SuperSprint discount if you want to swing that way, But also SS stuff goes on clearance a lot from turner since it doesn't move.

I have to say, their stuff though has fit every time and follow though when a set of headers cracked because of crappy AKG Group N engine mounts on a race car - Poly BS..

Talk about a dream boat exhaust setup! SS stuff is so nice, but I can’t justify dropping that kind of money on exhaust.

My buddy happens to be an excellent fabricator, so he’s doing the exhaust on the cheap, which is why I’m just using what I have. If the stromung ends up being too loud I can change the setup/add resonators/etc without too much hassle.

my latest incarnation was 64" it makes a decent more right down low 1750-2500rpm above that its the same

just find a low height dual in and out muffler for a resonator thats compact but got some volumer to it, this works much better than a pair of 4" OD hot dogs. i ended up getting one made eliminated drone very well,

Oh, awesome!! 64” it is, then. I’ll look into a compact muffler, good call on that. I haven’t had a loud car for quite a few years, so I think I am going to just use the one muffler and the x pipe at first and adjust from there.

[AWDBOB]

I was having a chat with the squid-man Jay about M42 stuff and oil stuff (he is making some really cool oil additives now, called sssquid ink, his wiki page on oil is pretty nifty), when he mentioned that he had a new M20 product drop, which I, of course was stoked about.

It's an intake ssspacer, that helps even airflow to each cylinder. His dyno results were impressive, see here: https://sssquid.com/v3/ssshop/ssspacer-m20/

Install was straight forward- double nut to remove the old studs, double nut to install longer studs. My throttle cable required a slight adjustment afterwords, and I had to bend my PS resevoir bracket. I have a BBTB, and the spacer was larger in diameter, so it worked out well.

Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr
Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr


I got my dbilas Flowmaster Intake in from the motherland. I need to borrow Mr Matt's rivnut tool to make a bracket, and she'll be in business. I'm going to have my buddy make an intake pipe for it (for megasquirt) when the car is there for the exhaust work.

Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr



And my 4 seasons A/C hose wasn't even close to being correct. Their stuff is obviously cheap, but this fitment was junk. I suspect it is setup for a different compressor, but even then, the fittings were in the wrong orientation.

Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr

[moatilliatta]

I wonder if the alternator shop would do M/S50/2/4 alternators. Bosch remans suck! Maybe some sort of GB.

The throttle spacer reminds me of the expansion piece miller did to make on the Big 6's for more plenum volume.

[digger]

I was having a chat with the squid-man Jay about M42 stuff and oil stuff (he is making some really cool oil additives now, called sssquid ink, his wiki page on oil is pretty nifty), when he mentioned that he had a new M20 product drop, which I, of course was stoked about.

It's an intake ssspacer, that helps even airflow to each cylinder. His dyno results were impressive, see here: https://sssquid.com/v3/ssshop/ssspacer-m20/

Install was straight forward- double nut to remove the old studs, double nut to install longer studs. My throttle cable required a slight adjustment afterwords, and I had to bend my PS resevoir bracket. I have a BBTB, and the spacer was larger in diameter, so it worked out well.

Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr
Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr


I got my dbilas Flowmaster Intake in from the motherland. I need to borrow Mr Matt's rivnut tool to make a bracket, and she'll be in business. I'm going to have my buddy make an intake pipe for it (for megasquirt) when the car is there for the exhaust work.

Untitled by Bobbie Morrone, on Flickr

the wear scar testing he has done as been around for decades and is pretty useless for motor oil, every now and then some new person starts doing it like it is the new best thing. There are there are some non oil products that do really well but have no place in an engine so using it to evaluate some home made additive just doesn't sound like the smartest idea. IMO do not add additives to oil unless it has been done by a chemist and results from multiple types of tests reviewed by a tribologist. Or in other words use an oil that does what you want right off the bat rather than snake oil.

its good that someone is still trying to polish turds (OE manifold), if one had alloy welding skills you could fix a few issues with OE manifold plenum and runner entry but probably never address the head to port interface issue that simply hurts flow numbers once you get to a certain power level.

interesting to see how the dbilas flow master fits in

[digger]

I've seen those kind of spacers on other engines, i made one to allow fitment of an even bigger 68mm TB with different bolt pattern than the standard m20 +3mm BBTB and tried to reshape it to diverge gradually like the divergent part of venturi and bogged manifold internally with JB weld to help, but i never ended up running it as Rama just brought out his ITB kit.

[AWDBOB]

I wonder if the alternator shop would do M/S50/2/4 alternators. Bosch remans suck! Maybe some sort of GB.

The throttle spacer reminds me of the expansion piece miller did to make on the Big 6's for more plenum volume.

I'm sure he would. I have a ton of cores, I'll ask him the next time I'm there. And yeah, I've always wanted to see what one of those powerfolds would do on a b35, but now that Rama makes M30 throttles I doubt we'll ever see any real results from the Miller unit. I doubt it is of much significance.

the wear scar testing he has done as been around for decades and is pretty useless for motor oil, every now and then some new person starts doing it like it is the new best thing. There are there are some non oil products that do really well but have no place in an engine so using it to evaluate some home made additive just doesn't sound like the smartest idea. IMO do not add additives to oil unless it has been done by a chemist and results from multiple types of tests reviewed by a tribologist. Or in other words use an oil that does what you want right off the bat rather than snake oil.

its good that someone is still trying to polish turds (OE manifold), if one had alloy welding skills you could fix a few issues with OE manifold plenum and runner entry but probably never address the head to port interface issue that simply hurts flow numbers once you get to a certain power level.

interesting to see how the dbilas flow master fits in

I've seen those kind of spacers on other engines, i made one to allow fitment of an even bigger 68mm TB with different bolt pattern than the standard m20 +3mm BBTB and tried to reshape it to diverge gradually like the divergent part of venturi and bogged manifold internally with JB weld to help, but i never ended up running it as Rama just brought out his ITB kit.

Yeah it's definitely nice to have another affordable bolt-on m20 piece on the market! I doubt it'll be a game changer, but for the price it's a cool addition. I'm honestly surprised no one made one, as intake spacers are common bolt on across almost any modding platform.

And the flowmaster will be nice, as it'll give me a mount for my cruise as well, should tidy up the engine bay a good bit and hopefully flow a little better than the stock box.