Gun Thread

[naplesE30]

Ordered a Larue mbt for the 300blk pistol. Will report back on how it copmares vs the geiselle ssa-e. Also going to swap out the pistol grip on my ar for an ergo tactical deluxe grip. I have large hands and hopefully it will better fill the palm of my hand.

[TeXJ]

I work at a major NGFW company and our operating systems that are put out...im not sure how they pass our QC... They do a quick blip and send it out. Granted we can't test for every possible scenario,...but yeah...

[Exodus_2pt0]

And therein lies the rub. The firearms market (and I guess so many other markets) move so quickly, and are so fickle, that companies have to get something out ASAP in order to grab a market share, even if that means less time in QC. I see it daily in my business (construction) where we are pushed to meet ever tighter schedules; while not the same thing, it is related. Something has to give somewhere.

Sounds like the gaming industry as well. Takes a year for new releases to actually run right these days, then the next game is out. It sucks.

[Rob]

More and more companies seem to be using their customers for the main QC of a product.

And therein lies the rub. The firearms market (and I guess so many other markets) move so quickly, and are so fickle, that companies have to get something out ASAP in order to grab a market share, even if that means less time in QC. I see it daily in my business (construction) where we are pushed to meet ever tighter schedules; while not the same thing, it is related. Something has to give somewhere.

[TeXJ]

A striker fired gun is the same basic design,...yes. However, the design of the magazine is what is new and in that size of a package.

I love my P365. I think we all would like to 'trust' a company that brings out a new product and hope that product is perfect. That's not the case anymore,...with any product.

Like you don't buy the first year of a new car model. You don't install the new OS of a platform,...etc.

More and more companies seem to be using their customers for the main QC of a product.

[varg]

Pushing the envelope? In what way? In the example of the P365, its basic design has been in use for decades and it doesn't really depart significantly from the basic design of a common striker fired pistol in any way, it's more of an incremental change and a new product for sig. If the issue with P365 dragging and breaking firing pins is an inherent design flaw in the striker mechanism or firing pin, it should've been caught in testing and was just sloppy design, if it was a flaw in the parts it should have been caught in QC checks and it was sloppy QC. There's really no way to sugar coat it, they dropped the ball and didn't respond like they should. It happens from time to time, nothing to tear the entire company apart over and boycott them forever, but the way it went down is something a company like sig should be beyond and it definitely reflects negatively on the current state of the company.

[naplesE30]

I think Sig has been pushing the envelope with new developments and as such experienced some flaws. The feedback I have heard is they are pretty quick about turning people’s guns around once received for work or modification.

The politics of getting them to put out recalls sounds like it was an ordeal to get through? That doesn’t surprise me though as a company with the possibility to lose millions on a recall isn’t going to react with a snap decision. Anyway from what I can tell they are trying to make things right, and largely have from what I can tell. However, I totally get going with another manufacturer who is not having any design problems. Lots of great manufacturers to deal with and why risk the hassle.

[Rob]

All that said, I'd rock the shit out of a MPX copperhead...

[ThatM20Guy]

Customer service has been a huge issue for Sig historically. Some people have received great service, but it seems like there were just as many negative reviews as positive.

Then completely bumblefucking the whole P320 drop safety issue until they basically were forced to address it because a handful of gun channels were able to replicate the fault and clearly illustrate it was a real and widespread problem.

Thinking they would have learned from that, when the new P365s came out there were issues with firing pins breaking and Sig decided to downplay that as well. AGAIN youtubers were showing the same problems that owners were reporting so they released statement and a "voluntary" recall to replace what they said was a bad heat treat with some of their firing pins or some BS. After the P320 debacle they should have just addressed it head on, apologized, and said that due to it being a new design that they anticipated issues but thought they had all been ironed out. Instead they tried to say there was nothing wrong and brushed owners off AGAIN.

Now it looks like instead of licensing the SB Tactical brace for their new "pivoting blah blah brace system", as they have been since SB designed the original brace, they've all but stolen the design and cut SB out entirely. I get that is a business decision as it's probably a hell of a lot cheaper to manufacture something in house if you're capable. I don't know if there is more to the story on this, but I really don't like it when an already huge company profits off of someone else's hard work unless they're being compensated.

I own several Sigs and I'd still like to try out a P365. But until Sig is willing to sack up and put customers before investors, I won't be going out of my way to add any of their new products to my safe.

Man that is really unfortunate. My 226 has been one of my favorite guns in the safe. I knew the 320 had a widespread issue but hadn't heard of the other issues. I too still wound't be opposed to trying one to see if it would beat out my Glock.


I think I am going to get a CZ 75 SP-01. I can't seem to get away from the DA/SA guns

[myinfernalbmw]

Ive been in the dark what have they done?

Customer service has been a huge issue for Sig historically. Some people have received great service, but it seems like there were just as many negative reviews as positive.

Then completely bumblefucking the whole P320 drop safety issue until they basically were forced to address it because a handful of gun channels were able to replicate the fault and clearly illustrate it was a real and widespread problem.

Thinking they would have learned from that, when the new P365s came out there were issues with firing pins breaking and Sig decided to downplay that as well. AGAIN youtubers were showing the same problems that owners were reporting so they released statement and a "voluntary" recall to replace what they said was a bad heat treat with some of their firing pins or some BS. After the P320 debacle they should have just addressed it head on, apologized, and said that due to it being a new design that they anticipated issues but thought they had all been ironed out. Instead they tried to say there was nothing wrong and brushed owners off AGAIN.

Now it looks like instead of licensing the SB Tactical brace for their new "pivoting blah blah brace system", as they have been since SB designed the original brace, they've all but stolen the design and cut SB out entirely. I get that is a business decision as it's probably a hell of a lot cheaper to manufacture something in house if you're capable. I don't know if there is more to the story on this, but I really don't like it when an already huge company profits off of someone else's hard work unless they're being compensated.

I own several Sigs and I'd still like to try out a P365. But until Sig is willing to sack up and put customers before investors, I won't be going out of my way to add any of their new products to my safe.

[Ludwig]

Ive been in the dark what have they done?

For one they had terrible waiting times and communication about it. I tried to get a 716 Patrol. At first they quoted a delivery time of 3 months which is okay. Then it was 1 year. Then it was "unknown" and they didn't take any more orders. In that time the price went up. Now it seems you either get one with acceptable waiting times or none at all.

Bought the HK MR 308/G28 then. Delivery time 3 days from the factory. Best gun i ever had.

[ThatOneEuroE30]

I really do want a .300blk Rattler. Sig has turned me off based on a lot of their recent actions as a company though, so in addition to the hefty price tag, that has pushed it down my want list.

Ive been in the dark what have they done?

[acolella76]

I really do want a .300blk Rattler. Sig has turned me off based on a lot of their recent actions as a company though, so in addition to the hefty price tag, that has pushed it down my want list.

That's sad but true. I love my Sig but I don't see myself buying anything else from them given what else is out there... mainly Q and their Honey Badger

[myinfernalbmw]

Something like that already exists... it's called a Sig MCX :)


All kidding aside I am digging Brownell's repro vintage stuff. The XM177 has been calling my name lately

I really do want a .300blk Rattler. Sig has turned me off based on a lot of their recent actions as a company though, so in addition to the hefty price tag, that has pushed it down my want list.

[acolella76]

That's kinda of my opinion. If they make a 10.5 that would make the ultimate truck gun with a side folder.

Something like that already exists... it's called a Sig MCX :)


All kidding aside I am digging Brownell's repro vintage stuff. The XM177 has been calling my name lately